Atkins Diet - Lets Discuss Pros/Cons/Experiences

[Thremp]

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if you don't have any science behind your claims.

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This is your whole problem. Somehow the pseudo science you provide is a cut above. Did you read the BB.com thread you linked? Its full of information supporting fast acting carbs.

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle....e=body_141post

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=462147

I think there's enough information there to back our claims not to mention the other boatloads of studies on the interwebs. You keep eating the oat meal PWO and blunting IR and telling yourself this stuff. Just don't pollute anyone else's mind.

[jah7_fsu1]

I swear some of you guys act as if I've called your mother a skank or something. Do you all sell dextrose? Why all the hate for asking questions, sparking discussion, providing another viewpoint? I think this "post-workout window" talk is largely debatable at best. Yes it is clearly polluting someone's mind to spark talk or say...wait, how do you know that?

Thremp/Others:

Funny how you'd link Berardi after calling him a moron for Massive Eating...which is it?

Psuedo science...how are the studies I've linked "psuedo science?" You haven't presented ANY studies that have directly compared the two and that is fine...because they DON'T EXIST. All I'm saying is that I think I can produce as much evidence for a mixed ratio than anyone can produce for only fast acting GI carbs. Who's right? I have no idea! I've already said I use high GI carbs post-workout, but I'm not sure they are IDEAL for a diet like this. I like the debate going, I'm interested in this type of thing, I think people learn things from discussing. I just don't know why someone has to say "OMG go to high school" or call arguments assinine. It doesn't really add anything so let's keep them out.

I directly asked this question to a guy who works for AL. No, AL doesn't currently have a postworkout drink so I don't need to hear how they are biased, whatever. Especially when this guy has his doctorate in nutritonal studies.

"GIs are irrelevant from a performance standpoint if you're a lifter and not a performance athlete. They are relevant for gains &/or body composition depending on your phenotype & body composition goals."

[guids]

They are relevant for gains &/or body composition depending on your phenotype & body composition goals."


well, wtf? isnt that a quote supporting what Im saying? See the contention is not about the Glycemic index that you keep making it out to be, it is the insulin that is anabolic. You are manipulating hwo your bdoy uses its insulin, to become anablic by feeding your body PWO, high GI carbs just make a large insuline spike possible. There are tons and tons of articles, just google anabolism and insulin, youll find what Im talking about.

[Thremp]

guids,

Actually IR works a little better than GI, since there are some factors (which are beyond me to currently understand) that causes the two to be highly correlated but unequal.

[guids]

[ QUOTE ]
guids,

Actually IR works a little better than GI, since there are some factors (which are beyond me to currently understand) that causes the two to be highly correlated but unequal.

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I may have phrased it wrong, high GI foods spur the spike in insulin, you cant get a large (as big as no carb, working out, then pwo shake, at least) insulin spike w/o high GI foods. The spike in insulin in turn "shoots" your protein adn carbs into your liver, muscles, etc. You cant eat high GI carbs all the time because your body will adapt and stop producing the insulin, in turn your body will nto use the carbs and protiens as efficiently. You do this postworkout because after a workout your body is most insulin sensitive so a high spike from teh high gi carbs is why a lot of people sometimes see sick gains from changing their post workout nutrition. Basically what you are doing, is "injecting" yourself with insulin w/o a needle to get the most out of your food.

[Thremp]

I'm talking about Insulin Response, its a different measurement from glycemic index. Almost the exact same but some slight differences.

I do understand exactly what you are saying though. Just suggesting a different chart for optimal decisions.

[guids]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm talking about Insulin Response, its a different measurement from glycemic index. Almost the exact same but some slight differences.

I do understand exactly what you are saying though. Just suggesting a different chart for optimal decisions.

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I am under the impression that teh glycimec index and insulin response of foods are directly related? Ie the higher the GI, the higher the IR?

[Thremp]

guids,

Highly correlated, but not always. Some foods have a lower GI but a much higher IR. Candy Bars come to mind in this. Diabetes FTW.

[skunkworks]

Just to add onto Thremp's post, there's plenty of evidence that shows that fat ingested with carbohydrates can actually increase insulin response depending on how much of those fats are saturated.

What we all hear about is how fat will blunt insulin response because it slows down gastric emptying and therefore the release of glucose into blood (which is why we don't put peanut butter in our post-workout shakes). However, saturated fat + carbs have some sort of synergy that causes a disproportionate insulin response. Fries, baked goods, and fatty-fat-fat ice cream are big-time offenders.

Other notable foods that have a low GI but high Insulin Index include milk, yogurt, and baked beans (very bad).

[Thremp]

skunk,

Very interesting. If I'm not mistaken, the "badness" of saturated fats doesn't make up for the increased IR over something like dextrose, no?