$114 hand vs. Ryanghall

[ryanghall]

Again, it's not his range that's relevant. It's the fact that 7 people are left to act behind me and I obviously can't call an allin w/ AQ, 99

[suzzer99]

But would you fold those hands if UTG hadn't bet? If not, then why fold to a raise you know is mega-wide with 285 chips for the taking? As I think Roland said in his post, starting out at 1100 chips is not the end of the world. I do it all the time.

Edit: Oh hey this was my 4000th post. Tra la la la boom-dee-ayyy. Cue the elephants.

[Pudge714]

[ QUOTE ]
Again, it's not his range that's relevant. It's the fact that 7 people are left to act behind me and I obviously can't call an allin w/ AQ, 99

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you calling with AK, and TT?

[ryanghall]

I'm raising with AK.

TT is a tough one.

Suzzer you're comparing apples to oranges. Of course I'm not folding those hands for a minimal amount of chips.

Things change when there's almost 300 chips in the pot right off the bat. People will go for them.

Ryan

[The Venetian]

[ QUOTE ]
But would you fold those hands if UTG hadn't bet? If not, then why fold to a raise you know is mega-wide with 285 chips for the taking? As I think Roland said in his post, starting out at 1100 chips is not the end of the world. I do it all the time.

Edit: Oh hey this was my 4000th post. Tra la la la boom-dee-ayyy. Cue the elephants.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course not, but there's a big difference between putting 300 chips and 60-90 chips into the pot preflop when you're way out of position. I agree his range is probably wider than normal for UTG, but I really don't like the idea of putting 300 chips out with the distinct possibility I won't even see a flop. Situations vs. cards.

[suzzer99]

[ QUOTE ]
Suzzer you're comparing apples to oranges. Of course I'm not folding those hands for a minimal amount of chips.

Things change when there's almost 300 chips in the pot right off the bat. People will go for them.

Ryan

[/ QUOTE ]

There's something paradoxical about this line of thinking that I can't quite put my finger on. You're saying that you would raise AQ to pick up 45 chips. But you would pass on the chance to pick up 300, because someone might come over the top with a worse hand and you'd have to fold? Something just doesn't feel right about that logic to me.

[suzzer99]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But would you fold those hands if UTG hadn't bet? If not, then why fold to a raise you know is mega-wide with 285 chips for the taking? As I think Roland said in his post, starting out at 1100 chips is not the end of the world. I do it all the time.

Edit: Oh hey this was my 4000th post. Tra la la la boom-dee-ayyy. Cue the elephants.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course not, but there's a big difference between putting 300 chips and 60-90 chips into the pot preflop when you're way out of position. I agree his range is probably wider than normal for UTG, but I really don't like the idea of putting 300 chips out with the distinct possibility I won't even see a flop. Situations vs. cards.

[/ QUOTE ]

So you fold AQ here?

[Melchiades]

I do.

[ryanghall]

Yup.

[Eagles]

A few random thoughts
1. I truly thought the only hands RGH would call a shove with were AA and KK.
2. In RGH's position I think I am calling or reraising 99+ AK+ and an argument can be made for 88 and AQ depending on the table. Keep in mind it's pretty easy to get rid of the hands at the bottom of the range if someone comes in behind.
3. Outside of AK everyhand for RGH is a call or fold. If you reraise QQ+ you drive out worse hands and if you reraise JJ- you only get action from better hands. Me having JJ is one of the only scenarios where a call ends up being bad.
4. Does everyone agree that qq is a call if an unknown is pushing.