return to FTP 3/6, part 1

[jfish]

[ QUOTE ]
btw, these are not the right cards and not the right flop to donk

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree.

[jfish]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
hate basically every decision unless donking the flop with hands like this fits well into your gameplan, but you really cannot argue that the turn is anything but horrible

[/ QUOTE ]

what this kid said

[/ QUOTE ]

[aislephive]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
do yall think he ever gets to the turn like this with a weak ace, says "oh crap what have i done" and turns it into a bluff? (and folds to a c/r, obv)

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, a lot of the time, actually.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is sarcastic, right?

[bigbabyjesus]

STICK TO PETTING YOUR KITTY AND BODOG, FISH

[dtan05]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
do yall think he ever gets to the turn like this with a weak ace, says "oh crap what have i done" and turns it into a bluff? (and folds to a c/r, obv)

[/ QUOTE ]

yes, a lot of the time, actually.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is sarcastic, right?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, plenty of people who don't hand read because of too many tables, or can't, will simply be like LOL ZOMG SO MUCH MONIES I ONLY HAVE TPMK EZ FOLD.

[DJ Sensei]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
btw, these are not the right cards and not the right flop to donk

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree.

[/ QUOTE ]

why is this, exactly? I think he gives up his hand pretty quickly (calls with most any ace or maybe a pair of kings, raises or folds anything else.) Its just a matter of what % of his trash range he raises or folds.

[BalugaWhale]

[ QUOTE ]


why is this, exactly? I think he gives up his hand pretty quickly (calls with most any ace or maybe a pair of kings, raises or folds anything else.) Its just a matter of what % of his trash range he raises or folds.



[/ QUOTE ]
the reason it is bad is because
A) if you are bluffing, you have no FE
B) if you are going for value, you are rarely getting called by worse, and if worse decides to play, it usually puts you in a shtty spot by raising and making you do things like this with 2nd pair 2nd kicker OOP.

your bet is to define his hand, AKA for information, AKA it sucks.

sometimes it is okay to donk the flop if many cards help you fire the turn successfully (either as a bluff or for value). in this case, nothing helps you but a K or a J, and even those might not help you.

[DJ Sensei]

[ QUOTE ]

your bet is to define his hand, AKA for information, AKA it sucks.

[/ QUOTE ]

yea, it is, but in this case he raises with crap and calls with most hands that beat me. how can that be bad, if the information i get is "hey, i have no hand and i'm putting lots more money in the pot!"


i guess my real point here is that i prefer to force or trick people into making big mistakes (and generally not realize how big the mistakes are until its too late) than to sit back and wait for them to do something stupid on their own.

[KRANTZ]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


why is this, exactly? I think he gives up his hand pretty quickly (calls with most any ace or maybe a pair of kings, raises or folds anything else.) Its just a matter of what % of his trash range he raises or folds.



[/ QUOTE ]
the reason it is bad is because
A) if you are bluffing, you have no FE
B) if you are going for value, you are rarely getting called by worse, and if worse decides to play, it usually puts you in a shtty spot by raising and making you do things like this with 2nd pair 2nd kicker OOP.

your bet is to define his hand, AKA for information, AKA it sucks.

sometimes it is okay to donk the flop if many cards help you fire the turn successfully (either as a bluff or for value). in this case, nothing helps you but a K or a J, and even those might not help you.

[/ QUOTE ]

what if he calls you with TT? what if he raises you with nothing? what if you can manipulate him to make mistakes by leading?

if you can work a lead like this into a bigger gameplan, you can't quantify the line as being bad at all