a concept borrowed from NL - Page 4

Josh. · #31 05-08-2007, 04:54 PM

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But doesn't that take all the credibility out of your river raise?

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i think it's pretty well in line with something like Q7. i guess i'd just bet the flop with that though since i had a gutter.

i dont know. i basically made up the hand, it's a bad example ok. i wish i had taken the time to formulate a better one. i still think the concept of bluffing with the bottom end of your range when your opponent believes you can't be bluffing can be a great play

TheCount212 · #32 05-08-2007, 05:06 PM

No one ever checks flush draws on the flop? They certainly do when someone checks in front of them. Or are you allergic to free cards? And if this player was so tenacious, and you had nothing, why so sure he'll fold?

The board didn't scream "straight" to you? I don't understand why you called on the turn, frankly.. and I certainly don't get the raise PF. Just seems to me that you played the hand badly from the start.. so why make it worse by raising on the river when you A) have nothing and B) will most assuredly be called. I mean, what were you hoping for.. hitting an A on the river with the weakest possible kicker?

3rdCheckRaise · #33 05-08-2007, 05:15 PM

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No one ever checks flush draws on the flop? They certainly do when someone checks in front of them. Or are you allergic to free cards? And if this player was so tenacious, and you had nothing, why so sure he'll fold?

The board didn't scream "straight" to you? I don't understand why you called on the turn, frankly.. and I certainly don't get the raise PF. Just seems to me that you played the hand badly from the start.. so why make it worse by raising on the river when you A) have nothing and B) will most assuredly be called. I mean, what were you hoping for.. hitting an A on the river with the weakest possible kicker?

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MSHE forum is a place where SSHE forum meets high stakes posters...once in the while

jkamowitz · #34 05-08-2007, 05:53 PM

This is mildly unrelated -

In the hypothetical hand described above, Josh, if he hypothetically calls your river raise, do you muck or show?

Josh. · #35 05-08-2007, 06:12 PM

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No one ever checks flush draws on the flop? They certainly do when someone checks in front of them. Or are you allergic to free cards? And if this player was so tenacious, and you had nothing, why so sure he'll fold?

The board didn't scream "straight" to you? I don't understand why you called on the turn, frankly.. and I certainly don't get the raise PF. Just seems to me that you played the hand badly from the start.. so why make it worse by raising on the river when you A) have nothing and B) will most assuredly be called. I mean, what were you hoping for.. hitting an A on the river with the weakest possible kicker?

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1. in blind steal spots with the lead headsup, lol no no one ever ever ever ever ever checks flush draws.
2. you're suggesting folding A2s on the button when it's folded to me? lol

TheCount212 · #36 05-08-2007, 06:30 PM

1. I think you're wrong about that. The prudent play would be to c/c to A) possibly get a free card and B) avoid being raised. The last thing you want on a draw is to be raised. Besides, why would you think he were on a flush draw when he checked the flop and then bets out on the turn-- when a blank hits-- given that the bet is 2x BB at that point. Makes absolutely no sense.
2. Of course not suggesting you fold PF. I suggested that you call PF. You can't possibly believe that a BB won't call a 2x raise to see a flop, virtually with any two cards. Blind stealing in L or MLH is about as easy as bluffing. Not very.

I guess I didn't know that you made up this example. Perhaps that's why it makes little sense.

The very title of your post indicates that you're trying to cram NL concepts into the LH game, and many times the opposite approach is warranted.

SA125 · #37 05-08-2007, 06:42 PM

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Couple thoughts here.. first, what are you planning on doing if he reraises you?

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Lol. Bluff raising is one thing and I think will work against good players. The player who 3 bets that river and folds to a 4th bet is rare. Limit poker is about crying calls with good hands. Schnieds had a good post in HS a while back about this with a fl out there.

Josh. · #38 05-08-2007, 07:11 PM

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1. I think you're wrong about that. The prudent play would be to c/c to A) possibly get a free card and B) avoid being raised. The last thing you want on a draw is to be raised. Besides, why would you think he were on a flush draw when he checked the flop and then bets out on the turn-- when a blank hits-- given that the bet is 2x BB at that point. Makes absolutely no sense.
2. Of course not suggesting you fold PF. I suggested that you call PF. You can't possibly believe that a BB won't call a 2x raise to see a flop, virtually with any two cards. Blind stealing in L or MLH is about as easy as bluffing. Not very.

I guess I didn't know that you made up this example. Perhaps that's why it makes little sense.

The very title of your post indicates that you're trying to cram NL concepts into the LH game, and many times the opposite approach is warranted.

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reading your post, i'm wondering if you're even looking at the right hand. i'm in position so i can't check/call. why would i want to anyway when i have good equity and fold equity

and are you seriously suggesting i open limp otb w A2s?

TheCount212 · #39 05-08-2007, 07:15 PM

lol.. right. I only ask the question b/c he seems convinced that villain will fold. Seems obvious to me that since villain bet out on the turn and river that he's calling any raise.

TheCount212 · #40 05-08-2007, 07:19 PM

You obviously hate being wrong. If you actually read what I posted I said the prudent play would be for VILLAIN to c/c if he's on a flush draw. Not you.
And yes, I am suggesting you limp, because why wouldn't BB call a 2x raise with any two cards head's up?