Common No Limit Situation

[mattgoody]

To the players who say they would fold because the BB wouldn't semi-bluff in this position: wouldn't the fact that he is playing against someone like you, someone who would give him credit for a big hand with that sort of bet, give him reason to semi-bluff?

[PantsOnFire]

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To the players who say they would fold because the BB wouldn't semi-bluff in this position: wouldn't the fact that he is playing against someone like you, someone who would give him credit for a big hand with that sort of bet, give him reason to semi-bluff?

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BB isn't just playing against you. There are four other players who also all called pf raises with something.

Do you really think a half pot semi-bluff bet is going to make 5 players fold in a raised pot?

[Dromar]

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Do you really think a half pot semi-bluff bet is going to make 5 players fold in a raised pot?

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If we've got people saying they would fold AQ here, then I'd say yeah, it's a possibility. Anybody that doesn't have relative position (like us) is going to be hardpressed to call, and by the time it gets back to the people who do have relative position, they are much more likely to fold because they have nothing. They called in the first place after 2+ people cold-called the initial raise.

I'm not saying BB is weak here all the time, or a lot. But I think it's a possibility that needs to be considered.

[PokrLikeItsProse]

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To the players who say they would fold because the BB wouldn't semi-bluff in this position: wouldn't the fact that he is playing against someone like you, someone who would give him credit for a big hand with that sort of bet, give him reason to semi-bluff?

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BB isn't just playing against you. There are four other players who also all called pf raises with something.

Do you really think a half pot semi-bluff bet is going to make 5 players fold in a raised pot?

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They're specified as being "generally good" players, so I am assuming they know that your bet is representing a big hand. Do you think that anyone with an ace is going to call on the flop? How tight does the rest of the table have to be for BB to have a profitable bluffing or semibluffing possibility here?

If you call, what can everyone else at the table put you on? It looks like AK (often with one or more diamonds) or a set, doesn't it? Am I missing any hands? If you do have the best hand, you'll probably get a cheap showdown. You might induce someone to throw away AK behind you. If you don't have the best hand, you can still throw your hand away on the turn to another bet. Plus, if BB would never semibluff with a draw, but has to have two pair or better, you might have some bluffing potential if a diamond comes and you can represent AK of diamonds.

People act like calling on the flop commits you to calling most of the times on the turn and river. Does it?

[Bet-and-win88]

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People act like calling on the flop commits you to calling most of the times on the turn and river. Does it?

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No but it gives away too much information. Or are there any other hands you'd play this way if you are straightforward and tight?

[bsheck]

This is a reverse implied odds situation. Raising is problematic because there are several players to act behind us and if one of them wakes up with a hand we're in trouble. Even if one of the 3 players with position on us flat calls the $1800, we can't like our hand very much and will likely have to give up on the turn. Easy fold with little money invested, poor relative position, and a hand with little chance of improvement if beaten.

[PantsOnFire]

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This is a reverse implied odds situation. Raising is problematic because there are several players to act behind us and if one of them wakes up with a hand we're in trouble. Even if one of the 3 players with position on us flat calls the $1800, we can't like our hand very much and will likely have to give up on the turn. Easy fold with little money invested, poor relative position, and a hand with little chance of improvement if beaten.

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This is what I have been saying. But it appears that a lot of what people have been saying seems to apply to a heads up vs. BB scenario.

Four other opponents increases the likelyhood of all those other bad hands. There could even be a guy with AK and he's probably not exactly thrilled either unless he has something suited happening.

I remember a segment on TV where they asked poker pros what hands they don't like playing and AQ came up a lot. Actually, even Doyle Brunson has commented on how much can be lost on that hand. And I do believe this is good example of such a situation. With no flush or straight hopes you are drawing to 2 outs for trips and 3 outs for two pair, both of which may not even be good enough.

[Matt Williams]

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there are so many pussies in this thread it is unbelievable.

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The problem is, most here don't play w/ stack sizes DS is talking about. So it's hard to rationalize raising to $1,800 if you've never won $1,800 in a pot let alone raise that.

[jogger08152]

David - what play/s do you like here?

[renereal]

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there are so many pussies in this thread it is unbelievable.

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Why do you make this statement?