A9s multiway with RIO

[Ampelmann]

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I would tend to raise on the flop (never folding here for one bet!) but this could be an example of "wait for a safe turn card to raise"

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This isn't the situation where someone bets, the whole table calls and you are last to act. I would just call there, since our edge is prolly not too big and noone will fold to a raise.

Here, we can face 3 players with 2 cold on the flop, thus limiting the field. Good but vulnerable hand, big pot -> I try to increase my equity by folding out others.

As a bonus, we get a lot of information if UTG 3-bets. In that case we can release the hand on the turn when the FD doesn't come.

[fretelöo]

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How would you play Fret when the Turn comes 7h and the tight-passive continues to bet in to us?

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Call down. What else? We can't raise and I probably couldn't fold either. Situation changes, of course if someone else decides to join the fun and raises.

[22pajo]

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22 - That was my thinking also but what hands are you going to force out? - flush draws will still have odds to call and then the pot will be large enough that they have odds on the turn also

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Hands like KQ, KJ, KT, QJ, QT etc. that might have weak Back door straight draws but have over cards to beat us should a K, Q, J or T come.
Yes flush draws still have odds to draw but if they call 2 cold at least you'll be able to narrow their range somewhat.

Play aggressively in large pots if it will improve your winning chances.

[seano34]

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How would you play Fret when the Turn comes 7h and the tight-passive continues to bet in to us?

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Call down. What else? We can't raise and I probably couldn't fold either.

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Would it not depend on what range you put him on? If you put him on a set then you are drawing dead. If he has two pair then it is a profitable call. So if you assume its equally likely he has a set as having two pair then its profitable but if you assume 60/40 set/2-pair then it isnt profitable and should be a fold?

[fretelöo]

Yes, but just because he bet the flop and didn't think too much of my raise, I would never put him on a set. He might just do this w J9s, really. So the flop bettor was 18/3/not-aggro BIG DEAL! I could see most draws and just about any pair donk this flop.

I want to showdown, I don't really think I have nearly enough information to fold but I don't like my hand enough to try anything fancy anymore. So I call down.

Actually, anyone who has a made straight or a set will most likely c/r me on the turn. A donk here indicates weakness, imho.

But, tbh, it's so much crystal-balling that it's not nearly worth the time. He could donk the flop with just about anything and he could donk the turn with quite a few improved draws that I beat. I really don't have any indication that I'm terribly behind, so I have to call to the river in any case and am probably not folding for one bet in what will be a massive pot.

[bozlax]

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i'm a psychologist, not an engineer.

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[DavidC]

With that card on the turn, I'm going to guess that my equity was approximately the same equity as it was on the flop.

[ChuckyB]

I'll usually limp this pre-flop. I have no moral objection to raising (if you have reason to believe a lot of people are coming along and can play well if an A flops)

Raise the flop. Waiting for the turn will let you see a safe card, but the odds you will be offering won't be much worse for your opponents.

[James.]

i usually limp preflop.

i like waiting for the turn to raise. no one is folding the flop and a gazillion hands are correct to call with as few as 4 outs for 2sb AND another million cards can come that we don't want to see and thus may be happy we didn't put the extra action in.

the problem i would be worried about is, given his description, the flop bettor may get scared if a paint card or other scarecard comes and then check leaving us in a semi-screwed position on the turn, plus we lost value on the flop. if he doesn't get scared by paint it often means we are behind with our one pair hand.

still, given the pot size and the relative vulnerabililty of our 9s it's a chance i'm willing to take because raising the flop usually results in at least the turn and often the river becoming a shootout(correctly)for any reasonable and a fair amount of unreasonable hands. on the turn we can better eliminate some of the riffraff we otherwise couldn't do with a flop raise. i feel like i stumbled/bumbled through this so i'm sorry if it makes little sense.

on the river, i think i'm valuebetting. it's a precarious situation if raised, but the pot's big so lots of crap hands like Ahigh or a draw that backed into a pair will call.

[martybonus]

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i'm a psychologist, not an engineer.

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bozlax for mod!

lovin' it.