Jason Varitek

[sublime]

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Its not surprising that teams who could hold onto catchers who can hit this well would be successful. A good hitting catcher (who doesnt suck defensively) is the single most valuable asset to a MLB team.

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I take it you think Mauer should be MVP.

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probably, yes.

even if he doesnt win MVP, he is still one of the top 3-4 assests in baseball.

[Joe Tall]

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the team was reeling when they got minky. they trade for him and go on a huge run, then win the world series. now he's gone and they haven't played at the same level since.

i don't see how blaming that on mientkiewicz is different than saying the loss of varitek directly translates into this big a difference in performance.

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Yes, nothing to do with Schilling's off season surgery last year and the loss of Pedro, you are right, Minky, Minky.


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teams go through slumps, especially against the best teams in the league. it's not always because one guy happens to not be there.

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The Sox bullpen has been getting clobbered. They were in the games over the two weeks, even over the weekend, they had plenty of chances to win. But the bullpen wasn't too good to begin with; it has three rookies in it, and now without the savvy veteran catcher they look lost on the mound.

[sublime]

joe the red sox were outscored the past 8 games 49-27

lets assume the 'savvy' varitek was behind the dish....how many runs less do they allow?

also, how do we know javy lopez isnt just as savvy? again, he was the catcher for the peak of arguably the greatest pitching staff in baseball history.

if tek is so savy, why is josh beckett having his worst year ever? he must not listen to tek. same must apply to clement and company.......

all this 'savvy' crap is media driven nonsense. they need a reason 'why' the red sox are losing and instead of looking at proveable reasons (other teams are better) they look at intangible reasons (zomg the leader and heart and soul is out) because they make for easier and better stories.

[sublime]

this thread should be titled

"tim wakefield"

as him being injured is a LOT larger of a factor than losing the 2006 version of jason varitek.

[THAY3R]

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joe the red sox were outscored the past 8 games 49-27

lets assume the 'savvy' varitek was behind the dish....how many runs less do they allow?


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54.5

[legend42]

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joe the red sox were outscored the past 8 games 49-27

lets assume the 'savvy' varitek was behind the dish....how many runs less do they allow?

also, how do we know javy lopez isnt just as savvy? again, he was the catcher for the peak of arguably the greatest pitching staff in baseball history.

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"Savvy", or "grittiness", or "leadership" don't really address what Varitek's greatest defensive asset is: his pitch calling. He has the strengths, weaknesses, and tendencies of AL hitters, especially the Yankees, burned into his brain, and he's practically a game theorist as far as varying his patterns. He knows how important it is to get ahead in the count, especially against the Yankees, he knows what each pitcher's best "get me over" pitch (and theior 2nd best, and their 3rd best...) as well as their best out pitch, and which hitters are most vulnerable to it, and which hitters know they're vulnerable to it enough to guess on it, and then just how often to cross them up.

These are things that Mirabelli hasn't had to concern himself with, and that Javy (even though he should have enough time in the AL to get a feel for the hitters) seems disinterested in- it seems likely most of the Braves' arms dictated the pitch selection, rather than the other way around as with the Sox and Tek. He and Mirabelli play it pretty much by the book (ABC poker as it were, which the Yankees' lineup can see coming down the Mass Pike), and when they do get creative, it's usually in the wrong direction- like too many 1st pitch breaking balls against the Yanks.

Just for instance, the 2-out 9th inning hit by Jeter in Sunday's game- unquestionably the biggest hit of the series, and probably won two games for the Yankees (if the Sox win Sunday, I think they win Monday too, I know momentum doesn't mean anything in baseball, but sometimes it does). Varitek knows Jeter *loves* to go the other way in those spots (it's almost the same inside-out flare that he hit against Pedro for a bases loaded triple in game 5 of the 2004 ALCS) and never would have called for a fastball on the outer half with an 0-1 count there.

Last night's game was also lost by terrible pitch selection. Bases empty, bottom of the 8th, 2 outs, 1-2 count to Guerrero, and Mirabelli's going to try to get him with a backdoor breaking ball? Does he think he's going to catch Vlad looking? And then after Vlad doubles, Delcarmen throws a nice looping curve to Anderson for strike 1 that he *seems* fooled by (he didn't buckle, he just barely reacted at all). So what does Delcarmen throw next? The exact same pitch. Again, no way Varitek calls that pitch. And these are games being crucially affected, and maybe decided, by pitch calling.

I know it's hard to mine evidence of a catcher's effect on a pitcher's performance from the stats, but sometimes you just have to watch the games.

[THAY3R]

If all of the stuff you are saying is true, there would be evidence of it.

[J.R.]

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He and Mirabelli play it pretty much by the book (ABC poker as it were, which the Yankees' lineup can see coming down the Mass Pike), and when they do get creative, it's usually in the wrong direction- like too many 1st pitch breaking balls against the Yanks.

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Even a good plan ain't worth [censored] without execution.

[kyleb]

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Bases empty, bottom of the 8th, 2 outs, 1-2 count to Guerrero, and Mirabelli's going to try to get him with a backdoor breaking ball?

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I don't see why not - Vlad can hit any pitch you throw him, so what the [censored] is the difference?

Besides that, there is no evidence for what you said.

[CharlieDontSurf]

your forgetting that jeter is the clutchiest of clutch...thus veritek could have called for a pitchout n Jeter would have still managed to hit a bloop single.