This website and why I love [censored]

[Mat Sklansky]

I am opposed to a profanity filter. Mason does leave moderation up to me, but he when sets a specific policy he expects that I make sure it is enforced. Mason doesn't swear. It's pretty funny, because he will quote swear words, but he won't use them, and doesn't see the need for them. Having said that, I'm not going to argue with him about the filter as I don't think removing it would actually be an improvement.

To Stuey: I just mean that many people are jerks, or at least their internet personas are jerks. When people are given freedom to express themselves openly, you see what happens. A low traffic forum like ATF could be controlled fairly easily. However, asking people to behave won't cut it, and at the end of the day, if people want to be rude. Who am I to tell them it's not entertaining. Don't get me wrong. I think there is a certain level of politeness that should be maintained, and I am very opposed to people going out their way to be cruel to someone who is obviously trying to be nice. But usually I see people battling, and those battles may look ugly, but the combatants usually seem willing.

[diebitter]

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To the others who say that [censored] + co don't enforce policies consistently...

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I thought it was consistent, right up until the freakin circus started. You ask posters their opinion in a contest format, you get mob rule, and all the hate that is STILL simmering away very nicely in the forum forum over Elaine.

Have a bit of dignity in there, and discuss among youselves who stays and who goes. Start a thread in here for OOT mods only or something. There's enough of you to get some concensus on borderline cases.

Stop acting so shamefully, I suggest.

The more 'dance, monkey, dance' you play at, the more sane, balanced and reasonable people get disgusted and leave OOT. I have - and I know that you guys don't give a rat's ass what I think about it, but I bet some of you have noticed posters you do like not posting so much anymore, haven't you?

And remember there's the Lounge now to cater for them, so it's not a case of OOT or nothing any more.

It's up to you OOT guys really, get some sense or you can only blame yourselves as it gets worse.

[Dids]

Nick/the rest of the OOT mods.

I would be intersted to understand exactly how that's working. Is there any group discussion or is it more that [censored] sets policy and the rest of y'all just clean up what you see when you get notified?

[Mat Sklansky]

[ QUOTE ]
Mat,
that was a nice post about [censored].

To the others who say that [censored] + co don't enforce policies consistently, I compare it to the police catching speeders. We don't see everything, so we can't enforce everything. I give the benefit of the doubt to many quality strategy posters, for example Nate tha' great posting a leather sofa thread about 6 hours after a different leather couch thread was started, however his was kept unlocked which i am sure he appreciated. If it was johnny oot, then it probably would have been locked.

Also, since i can't read every thread, we rely on the notify mod button.
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voluntarily clean it up. there is no reason for some of those posts out there or replies. it is the replies that really get raunchy and should be dealt with.


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Since june 26, I have gotten 44 notify mod responses. Only 9 have been in response to replies in threads. 20 were in response to spammers. The other 16 were in response to new threads. Considering the number of posts OOT gets, that isn't really a lot of notifications. Obviously if the posters wanted stuff cleaned up, they would hit the notify mod button more often, but they don't.

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Remember when I was the only one? This is the other reason I'm so permissive. Our members really don't seem to want heavy moderation. I'm actually going to try to get some feedback from our advertisers on OOT. If they tell me it's dead weight, that will definitely have an impact on my vision. Probably even greater than [censored]'s head in my anus. I'll keep people updated on that if I actually receive feedback.

[[censored]]

DB,

I am quite happy with the results of the culling and I think having it done it open while not entertaining to most also gave it more credibility.

It's my feeling that while unpleasant doing some big noisy things like this are the only way to get everyone's attention and let them know what's going on. I have found that when it comes to a large forum like OOT dealing with each instance quietly and in private does very little because for every villionaire, utah, AK, etc that quietly gets [censored] there will be 3 more popping up to take their place thinking its ok. This was very much my first experience moderating OOT and I think its a large part of why others failed.

I'm not going to argue that its not nice, or pleasant but in my opinion and the I believe the opinion of many others that's its effective.

I also don't think its gotten worse, infact I think this week in OOT has been very good so far.

[diebitter]

Well, I'm fine with public and obvious highlighting of asshat posters to telegraph the message, but not gladiator games. They'll be wanting more, of course, and I suppose you'll oblige. wonder which posters will he hounded out next? Ah, could be anyone, whoever the ball-swingers think isn't in favour that week, I suppose.

Anyway, you know how I feel about that crap, and we'll agree to differ.

[[censored]]

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Nick/the rest of the OOT mods.

I would be intersted to understand exactly how that's working. Is there any group discussion or is it more that [censored] sets policy and the rest of y'all just clean up what you see when you get notified?

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I think it would be fair to say that I set the policy but on the other hand when it comes to me/nick/yeti/daryn/thedude we all independantly share the same vision.

I also communicate with all regularly on AIM about various issues. One example of which was Spongers post, which I locked, then discussed with a couple of the others and as a result then unlocked.

I hope that answers your questions.

[Mat Sklansky]

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The Lounge shows at least some people appreciate a forum that enforces respect and being SFW.

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Can it not be argued that the short term success of the lounge is helped by OOT disgust? As much as I'm in favor of OOT, I'm in favor of chopping it up (I know most of you don't like this vision, including [censored]). I'd love to see these forums grow and have so many people that an automotive forum commanded 50 participants at any given time. And for the record, you and Astro were terrific. I didn't mean to snub you.

[diebitter]

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[ QUOTE ]
The Lounge shows at least some people appreciate a forum that enforces respect and being SFW.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can it not be argued that the short term success of the lounge is helped by OOT disgust? As much as I'm in favor of OOT, I'm in favor of chopping it up (I know most of you don't like this vision, including [censored]). I'd love to see these forums grow and have so many people that an automotive forum commanded 50 participants at any given time. And for the record, you and Astro were terrific. I didn't mean to snub you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks Mat,

Yes, of course. I think it's come back to life after all this, mostly down to the disgust, partly to the spam-attack and amusement over that but people seeing there was actually some good stuff (publicity is publicity, right?), and partly because of the title change and more significantly the index word change.

So I guess I should thank [censored] for that.


For the record, I do believe the Lounge is a concept that works best when the traffic doesn't get too high, and would be happy to see it split appropriately as it grows. I'd want to talk to prominent Loungers on that first though, to make sure it goes smoothly and is felt to be a suitable course of action.

Hell, you could have a 'Lounge' subsection on the menu for respectful, SFW posts, divided by subject (with TLR being the seed point for each)....

But this is speculation and blue-skying. We'll see what happens.

[Stuey]

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Obviously if the posters wanted stuff cleaned up, they would hit the notify mod button more often, but they don't.

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I don't think the posters want things cleaned up. Mason might though. Ray Zee seems to. Personally I don't mind it the way it is right now. I understand the fun posters get from pushing the limits I do it also.

Oot mods have done a great job imo. Some of the things [censored] does and what he tells you guys to do are not great ideas. My ideas pertain to thinking about the outcome of certian actions before taking them. Always think about who you are dealing with and the way they will react.

A new poster comes here for the first time and get banned = him holding resentment towards mods and becoming a troll on his next accounts. Or he never comes back.

Random poll deciding if people get kicked out = not good as some people that don't understand why it is funny and get hurt feelings. It starts a fight for a dumb reason.

A survivor with 2 people that get that it is the internet and they get to do whatever they want even if they lose = good times and high traffic. People blow of steam and they feel like they are part of something like they have input or control.

Just explaining myself because I think we agree. I just don't explain myself well.