Controversy with Sheets?!?!

[sheetsworld]

the utg player was and is a class guy and is not at fault at all...from what I was told, the dealer told him that he did not have to put his chips in the middle. If I were an utg alliner trying to steal with kQ, i know I PERSONALLY would have made every effort for everyone to see my chips...he was DEF not angle shooting because he did not WANT a call.

it would have been nice if I and the rest of the tournament participants were told as well though

Live and learn.

sheets

[Prime Time]

same thing happened in my instance (guy not angle shooting)as after the clock being called on me, and the floor giving me the count down, the vilain showed two ducks face up after I mucked. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

[jlocdog]

Tough hand sheets....

You are a tyremendous tournament player and in an event of this magnitude it really sucks when the "hi" end so "low". This mistep might have cost you 1,000,000 or nothing but we will never know.

What I do know is that as a dealer/player or player/dealer there are certain responsibilities that are given to all parties in play. AS A

[shaniac]

[ QUOTE ]
I guess UTG goes all in but doesn't do anything with his chips. Than Sheets annnounces all in from the SB with T3o trying to make a move on the BB. He is outchipped by the UTG and the UTG flips up KQo and it holds. Out 22nd.

To make it that far in anevent like this and have it end that way must be very frustrating. Do people here think you must move your stack in the middle to have your bet valid. I know verbal bets are binding and by saying all in is all that is needed, but maybe after you declare it you must have to make an effort to move your chips even a couple of inches to represent it? Thoughts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Competent tournament dealers/personelle enforce the rule (and at the Bellagio at least, it's a rule) that an allin should be represented by some significant amount of chips from the player's stack.

Unfortunately, Foxwoods tournament dealers are hardly competent, and do the absolute bare minimum to ensure the integrity or efficiency of the game.

[uclabruinz]

I'm pretty sure TDA Rules require the player to move a significant portion of his stack in when declaring an all-in.

[shaniac]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure TDA Rules require the player to move a significant portion of his stack in when declaring an all-in.

[/ QUOTE ]

It probably is...

In my experiences at Foxwoods (mind you, I hate that f'ing place and am probably biased), I've noticed an alarming level of dealer apathy/laziness.

Whereas it's usually standard for the dealer to "bring in the bets" (like when one player bets and get raised, the original bet amount is cut out of the raiser's stack so the original bettor can see the raise amount), they never do it at foxwoods unless you ask. When you DO ask, they usually give you a confused look and then begrudgingly do it. One time, in the midst of a big decision, I actually had a dealer give me attitude when I asked him to bring the bets in. In the sheets scenario, when utg declares allin and doesn't move his chips, the dealer is supposed to ask him to put a stack out, period.

This type of situation is far less likey to occured at a Vegas or LA casino.

[Erik Blazynski]

that is NOTHING. I have great foxwoods stories. I was in the main event last fall and the player ahead of me bet, then I raised, then another raise, then another raise, action is now back on me and I go all in.

Dealer says, "there is a 3 raise max" I explain that we are playing no limit and that this is not the case. I insist that they call the floor. The floor person comes over and agrees with the dealer. I pulled my bet back and folded my hand. Later the floor person comes back to the table and said that he asked the tournament director and that there is not a limit on raises. This was the difference between having 6K and having about 16K. It was aweful. I wasa so pissed. I mean it cost $10k to play and this is how they treat a situation like this?

Then I was playing in an Act II, and I was all in and I won. there were 2 other players and a side pot. I won, and the dealer pushed an arbitrary number of chips in my direction and states "is that right" she didn't know how to calculate the side pot and I made her reconstruct the hand and give me the right amount.

[runout_mick]

[ QUOTE ]

Dealer says, "there is a 3 raise max" I explain that we are playing no limit and that this is not the case. I insist that they call the floor. The floor person comes over and agrees with the dealer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Wow.

I mean: WOW

[wheatrich]

I have to highly disagree with the consensus here.

It's your responsibility to know what's going on at the table. If you don't it's your own problem not the dealers. I know I could easily make that mistake but it's not the dealers job to tell you all the action leading up to you if you weren't paying attention. (in fact I think it'd be wrong for a dealer to do this because if you aren't paying attention why should you now know what people did) T3o push=exit--you can't blame anyone other than yourself for this.

[sheetsworld]

I highly agree with wheatrich inasmuch as it is 100% my responsibility to know what the action has been, regardless of whether rules and protocol were broken prior to my action.

As I said, it certainly would have been nice for the rule to have been clarified in advance, it would have been nice for the dealer to have enofrced it, or at least made the player do something which was some i physical indicaton of his allin, or she could have , while i was obv thinking about something, said "208k to you sir" as they ALWAYS do when its like 50 to you and it ISNT for a zillion dollars..., but in the end, and for those kids out there, the responsibility lies squarely on the player to know what all of the action is before making a decision. In the very very end, u are repsonsible for ur own actions

Lesson in poker=Lesson in Life.

sheets