2k turbo, ?

[MATT238]

I think too many people are being too dependent on the buy-in here. Stick a decimal in the middle and make this a $20 SNG and I think you'll see more discussion.

If you know the BB to be an aggressive player, I like the limp pre-flop. Though, I would probably mix my play here. Sometimes raising- but I like the limp, especially 5 handed, because it'll be much easier to get the BB to put in a single raise, with little or no hand, to T600 or so that you can come over the top of, rather than to get him to 3-bet and put in half his stack or more.

Many people like a check on the flop here- why? I'd much prefer to lead the flop with a min. bet or so, for both value and information. This will also often get an aggressive player to float the flop and induce a bluff on a later street.

As played, I can't put the villian on a 9 very often, because in villian's shoes, I would often lead at the flop, but check behind on the turn for pot size control. Especially after getting check-called on that flop. So, I don't think he 3 barrels with a 9 here.

c/c turn looks good, and if your hand is good enough to call on the turn, the river should change nothing. His river bet is tens full or air most of the time. I think it's air here enough to make the crying call and become a big chipleader.

[ymu]

[ QUOTE ]
I think too many people are being too dependent on the buy-in here. Stick a decimal in the middle and make this a $20 SNG and I think you'll see more discussion.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think you're right about the reasons - intimidating buy-in - but wrong about the solution. Buy-in is pretty important here. I haven't responded so far because if it was my buy-in level I'd be screaming about preflop and demanding that we get it AI on the flop because 22 will call - clearly dumb advice here.

My instinct is to call the river, but no doubt for all the wrong reasons. In a lower buy-in it's because we've shown no strength and this could be lots of hands we beat because villain isn't thinking about what we have. In this buy-in, I guess it's because he likely has a very good idea of our hand and is aggressive enough to try and take us off it - I call because this seems likely enough (especially with the smallish turn bet and big river push) for a call to be profitable. Or it could just be because I'm a sucky calling station who will never ever play at this level.

[MadScientist]

I think Ax where x is like a T or lower so 2-8 included, should be in the range.
Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

273 games 0.001 secs 273,000 games/sec

Board: 9d 9c Th Ts 4h
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 48.352% 48.35% 00.00% 132 0.00 { KhKs }
Hand 1: 51.648% 51.65% 00.00% 141 0.00 { 88-44, A9s-A2s, T2s+, 92s+, A9o-A2o, QTo, J9o+, T2o+, 92o+ }


I know it is ghey that I poker stoved this, but this is with most every nine and ten except 99, TT and every Ace with some other stuff too.
I think it is a call because he could be betting an ace or a bluff. The lower pairs are in there as bluffs as they would bet flop and bet on as they are counterfeited to represent bluffs, though 44 boated up on river.

[MadScientist]

[ QUOTE ]
Guys,

Don't click on the link above. It gave me some sort of virus where if I try to navigate around the site, all I see are threads about Annette_15 and folding aces pf.

[/ QUOTE ]

God, Annetter_15 is so hot, if only I could piss [censored] [censored] [censored] her [censored] brains shitwillow horsecock [censored] out.
GL censorship filter with that BEEOTCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[spacegravy]

This hand kept buggin me tonight when i was watchin joey play so i made him post it to get some feedback. One thing you all didnt see is when joey checked the turn zangbezan bet out and joey used hid full time bank to make the call so i felt like at this point zang bezan put him on somethin like qq+ or maybe ahigh so he knew if he pushed the river joey would be good enough to get away from his hand but joey at this point knew what he was thinkin. Still a crazy spot and would like to here more from you all...

[ger664]

From what spacegravy is saying when we get to the turn villian is sure hero has a PP or a holding he wants to go to cheap showdown with.

a) Villian thinks hero will not call a river shove. It is reasonable for villian to shove with air here.
b) Villian thinks hero will call a river shove. It is reasonable for villian to shove the nuts here.

Unless u are able to read villians soul its impossible to get the right answer to this.

[AMT]

[ QUOTE ]
This hand kept buggin me tonight when i was watchin joey play so i made him post it to get some feedback. One thing you all didnt see is when joey checked the turn zangbezan bet out and joey used hid full time bank to make the call so i felt like at this point zang bezan put him on somethin like qq+ or maybe ahigh so he knew if he pushed the river joey would be good enough to get away from his hand but joey at this point knew what he was thinkin. Still a crazy spot and would like to here more from you all...

[/ QUOTE ]


i think this prob. pushes it from a close fold to a close call, everything given here not including a dead on read (which, as stated, only joe really has at this point) but with factoring the timing vs someomne with the same history that these two players have all leads to such a close spot that i dont think it can be significantly -EV either way. pending the read pushing this over im gonna say close but a call on the river.


edit: if it wasnt already clear i kind of want to vomit after reading this thread.

[ymu]

[ QUOTE ]
From what spacegravy is saying when we get to the turn villian is sure hero has a PP or a holding he wants to go to cheap showdown with.

a) Villian thinks hero will not call a river shove. It is reasonable for villian to shove with air here.
b) Villian thinks hero will call a river shove. It is reasonable for villian to shove the nuts here.

Unless u are able to read villians soul its impossible to get the right answer to this.

[/ QUOTE ]
Not really - it comes down to his range just like any other call when we don't have the nuts.

We only have to know that b) is likely enough to make it +$EV. With some villains this could never be a bluff, with others it'll almost always be a bluff - the rest are somewhere in between. The villain in the OP sounds like it could be a bluff often enough to make it worthwhile.

[Pudge714]

MadSci,
That range is really bad.
He nevers bets ace high on the river and a lot of it is still in his preflop range. Pairs are rarely in his preflop range and it is pretty unlikely he bets a nine on two streets.

Gravy,
Full time bank like 60 seconds or full time bank being up until his timebank loaded. If it is the latter he could definitely do that with a T or a 9.

[Daleroxxu]

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For a cleaner copy of my answer with pretty looking charts:

http://www.pocketfives.com/1BF7C841-...A98DB98A5.aspx

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I'm guessing that OP already has an understanding of equity implications in SNGs.