KQo - AQ3

[jeanbaptiste36]

[ QUOTE ]
I put this flop to pokerstove ...

57,420 games 0.005 secs 11,484,000 games/sec

Board: 3d Qd As
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 33.765% 28.51% 05.26% 16370 3018.00 { KcQh }
Hand 1: 66.235% 60.98% 05.26% 35014 3018.00 { TT+, ATs+, KJs+, AJo+, KQo }

At this flop we win 28% times (equity is 33,7% but i use only wins to make odds) so its about 3:1 odds.

Now we have 4.5SB+bet. If we make assumption that villian will bet all streets then he put 5sb+4sb= 4,5BB
And we need put 1sb+2sb+2sb=2,5BB
So pot odds are 4,5:2,5= 1,8 : 1

So if i only use at this hand math rules so it should be easy fold at flop [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Any sugestion about this simulation ?

[/ QUOTE ]

I would guess it's useless as it's not a draw. You might already be good. It's not 6d7d, where you can be very, very certain that you are drawing.

[jeanbaptiste36]

btw, been digging around with pokerstoves numbers and you are supposed to use the equity because a tied pot is equal to winning half a pot, which equity accounts for but not the win.

[StrictlyStrategy]

I love this thread so much. [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

[JJack]

[ QUOTE ]
btw, been digging around with pokerstoves numbers and you are supposed to use the equity because a tied pot is equal to winning half a pot, which equity accounts for but not the win.

[/ QUOTE ]

hmm
you probably right that when i use "win" stat then i assume i have draw, but i can still be ahead. good point ! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

But what if i dont use "win" stat and will use "equity" stat instead?
Then pokerstove should show "true" power of my cards and then its not importatnt im ahead or behind, am I right?

If yes then i have 33% equity do 2:1 and pot odds are 1,8:1 ... is it mean WA/WB ?

[KingOtter]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
btw, been digging around with pokerstoves numbers and you are supposed to use the equity because a tied pot is equal to winning half a pot, which equity accounts for but not the win.

[/ QUOTE ]

hmm
you probably right that when i use "win" stat then i assume i have draw, but i can still be ahead. good point ! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

But what if i dont use "win" stat and will use "equity" stat instead?
Then pokerstove should show "true" power of my cards and then its not importatnt im ahead or behind, am I right?

If yes then i have 33% equity do 2:1 and pot odds are 1,8:1 ... is it mean WA/WB ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Equity doesn't tell you when to call for a draw. Equity tells you when to bet. If equity > contribution (how much you bet) then you should bet.

For instance, nut flush draw on nonpaired flop gives you 35% equity. If someone bets, someone calls you can raise. You're contributing 33%, and your equity share is 35% so you're putting in less money than you will win, long term.

Pot-odds tell you when call when you're drawing to a likely winning hand. You need xx card to win, so you draw.

When you're not sure you're ahead or behind you need to run the permutations. xx combinations beat you, yy combinations lose to you, etc...

[JJack]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
btw, been digging around with pokerstoves numbers and you are supposed to use the equity because a tied pot is equal to winning half a pot, which equity accounts for but not the win.

[/ QUOTE ]

hmm
you probably right that when i use "win" stat then i assume i have draw, but i can still be ahead. good point ! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

But what if i dont use "win" stat and will use "equity" stat instead?
Then pokerstove should show "true" power of my cards and then its not importatnt im ahead or behind, am I right?

If yes then i have 33% equity do 2:1 and pot odds are 1,8:1 ... is it mean WA/WB ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Equity doesn't tell you when to call for a draw. Equity tells you when to bet. If equity > contribution (how much you bet) then you should bet.

For instance, nut flush draw on nonpaired flop gives you 35% equity. If someone bets, someone calls you can raise. You're contributing 33%, and your equity share is 35% so you're putting in less money than you will win, long term.

Pot-odds tell you when call when you're drawing to a likely winning hand. You need xx card to win, so you draw.

When you're not sure you're ahead or behind you need to run the permutations. xx combinations beat you, yy combinations lose to you, etc...

[/ QUOTE ]

oh i see thx for this post man !

So if i good understand when i draw need know pot odds and if we use pokerstove then we use "win" stat to make pod odds (we want only win when we risk cash and we dont wanna split pot)

And here is good permutation to estimate "true" power of my hand if i dont know where i am. Its why my upper count with using "equity" stat wasnt correct.

thx again for post.
pls tell me is my thinking procces correct now.

[voyamatarte]

Working out the math and theory on these boards is very interesting, but how does this help you when you are hovering your mouse of raise/fold/call and you have 30 seconds?

Are you people actually doing all this mental arithmatic at the table, are you estimating it through experience being in similar situations, or some combination?

[jeanbaptiste36]

In my head? No chance. You do the math away from the table.

[JJack]

To know have I played good hand after session and not to post all hands im unsure [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
PokerStove is great program but i have to know do i use it good.

[jeanbaptiste36]

[ QUOTE ]


So if i good understand when i draw need know pot odds and if we use pokerstove then we use "win" stat to make pod odds (we want only win when we risk cash and we dont wanna split pot)



[/ QUOTE ]

No, you always use the equity. Forget about the win. A split pot is still better than a lost pot.