FT200 4-bet sees a flop

[loosbastard]

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If you 4 bet to 90+ with AK then you can do the same with AA, KK, and QQ yourself.

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Do you ever 4-bet bluff? I mean sure pop it to 90 every time if you want...but what are you doing w/ A6s when he shoves? You put yourself in a spot where both calling and folding suck balls.

And this is dead [censored] on IMO:

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A $100 4 bet is just a bad middle ground where you don't give villain the option to bluff shove, he can still flat call and now we are in a really bad spot on the flop when we miss because we might have to consider calling a flop shove getting 3 to 1. It almost sounds like this is your reason for wanting to 4 bet larger just so you can't fold after the flop which is not a good reason to make a certain bet size.

[loosbastard]

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Don't really like either of these amounts much at all. If I had to pick one of those two amounts with this hand it would be $80 but again, I think neither of these amounts are very good.

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Why (seriously just want your reasoning)? What size would you pick?

[Noam Chomsky]

I like about 66 or so better with 100bb stacks. For one, I don't want to have more than a psb when I do end up seeing the flop. It's just akward.

I also think that $59 is so miniraiseish (combined with the fact that there will be more than a psb to play with) that it gets you called by lots more 99+ hands that want to get it in on a 'safe' flop that you don't want to see a flop without a turn and river at all when you've got AK whereas for a little more, you'll more often fold those hands out.

Also, when you miss and still shove (cause you're tilting cause your 4b got flatted), lots of poor planners now realize that it's just a psb and it becomes more credible than open over-shoving the flop.

[loosbastard]

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I also think that $59 is so miniraiseish

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So? Min-raising is fun!

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Also, when you miss and still shove (cause you're tilting cause your 4b got flatted), lots of poor planners now realize that it's just a psb and it becomes more credible than open over-shoving the flop.

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Who said you have to over-bet shove?

Seriously though, I think my smallish 4-bets get flatted like once every 30-40 times. Most just panic and either shove/fold.

[Noam Chomsky]

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Who said you have to over-bet shove?

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I did

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I hate people who flat 4-bets. Really really tilts me. Because of that I always shove here since I'm tilting, C/F is probably best.


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lol qft

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Seriously though, I think my smallish 4-bets get flatted like once every 30-40 times. Most just panic and either shove/fold.

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I still consider 66 a small four bet, just think it's a better 'small' amount. Dunno for sure though.

[Imrahil]

Guys I'm really [censored] confused here. In another thread I heard that you guys normally 4bet to about Nielso's size. Now you're saying it's too big and he should either shove or make it smaller. What amount do you normally 4bet to?

[djj6835]

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Guys I'm really [censored] confused here. In another thread I heard that you guys normally 4bet to about Nielso's size. Now you're saying it's too big and he should either shove or make it smaller. What amount do you normally 4bet to?


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I would be making it like 62 here. What thread are you talking about?

[Imrahil]

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Guys I'm really [censored] confused here. In another thread I heard that you guys normally 4bet to about Nielso's size. Now you're saying it's too big and he should either shove or make it smaller. What amount do you normally 4bet to?


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I would be making it like 62 here. What thread are you talking about?

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Nothing specific or that I can remember but they were just talking about 4-betting sizes.

[Trikkur]

I'm either 4-betting AI or 4-Betting to like 58. I've had tons of people fold to the smaller 4-bet, which allows me to 4-bet bluff. The only thing is you really have to mix it up.

As played, C/F

[bilbo-san]

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How can an 18/14 be aggro/laggish pre-flop?

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First, I didn't say pre-flop. Second, easy: with the hands that you *do* play, you play them aggro/laggish.

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Your saying he turns made hands into bluffs? The "l" in laggish means loose, so idk what this means.