Time's Klein on Affirmative Action - Page 4

JohnnyHumongous · #31 12-13-2006, 04:08 AM

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An argument that has been made for affirmative action is that to not have some kind of affirmative action program is racist. That is, if we believe that blacks and whites, given the same preconditions, would attain equal status in the society, the fact that they have not must be due to deficiencies in societal structure that cause blacks to do less well. So affirmative action, in effect, levels the playing field by "making up" for those deficiencies. What affirmative action looks for, then, is equality of results as a true measure of an unbiased society.

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People don't actually still buy into this half-baked argument do they? I thought it went out with alchemy and phrenology.

Fact is affirmative action has more to do with socialism than racism- an attempt at "evening things out" without respect to people's talents, ambition and effort. The longterm effects are also the same as socialism:

1) Resentment created in those "held back" (the well-off in the case of socialism, and white males in the case of AA)

2) Less output in the economy and less wealth for society as a whole (in socialism because money is taken away from those who best know how to employ it productively, and in AA because lesser-qualified people are given positions they didn't earn)

3) The removal of APPROPRIATE INCENTIVES (in socialism because people realize that they don't have to work hard if they so choose, and the government will ensure they maintain a subsistence level of living, and in AA because minorities realize they don't have to achieve the same level of aptitude or effort to be given the same achievements as white males)

This last point is so critical and obvious. If I was a 16 year old hispanic boy who wanted to go to the Ivy League and someone told me, "Don't worry about your grades so much, you don't need a 4.0, because you're hispanic they will admit you even if you only have a 3.5... Oh and also you don't need a 1500 on the SAT, 1100 would make you a shoo-in," well let me tell you I'd chuck my binder and go play video games instead of studying like a dog. And diversity programs extend to post-BA hiring, grad school applications etc. It's a sustained phenomenon and it creates an attitude in the minority from a young age that they don't need to achieve at as high a level as their white peers to get the same results.

The fact is I know a lot of minorities who are not "oppressed" or "systematically prejudiced against". I'm from a typical well-educated liberal town where the white people try to be "better understanding". There are minority kids whose parents have PhDs and are lawyers and doctors yet they get preference when applying to Ivy League schools.

I went to an Ivy League college actually, and sat beside black kids whose parents graduated from Harvard and who grew up in Greenwich and Cambridge MA. Meanwhile I'm as white as it gets, and I can honestly say I have never been the beneficiary of systematic racism in my favor. My parents have grade school education and my father is an entrepreneur. If you could choose one sentence to describe their lives it would be "hard work day in and day out with absolutely no support from anyone." During school if anything I was discriminated against by the army of liberal female teachers who probably disliked the fact that I was a blond, white male, tallest in the class, bright and confident. I would love to find this secret world where white people somehow get benefits no one else gets because I think it's a lot of fantasy that liberals engage in to justify their inexplicable addiction to socialism which they manifest through AA.

HeavilyArmed · #32 12-13-2006, 03:05 PM

Nice post. Thank you.

My son paid into the AA spoils system. He was on the wrong side of the cusp for admission to the Air Force Academy and far too white. The Naval Academy did accept him so I know of what I speak. The military had a large quota of minority officer positions to fill so it's no longer a merit based system. Sad indeed. The one place where I'd like to have the very best, defending America.

Money2Burn · #33 12-13-2006, 04:04 PM

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I went to an Ivy League college actually, and sat beside black kids whose parents graduated from Harvard and who grew up in Greenwich and Cambridge MA. Meanwhile I'm as white as it gets, and I can honestly say I have never been the beneficiary of systematic racism in my favor. My parents have grade school education and my father is an entrepreneur. If you could choose one sentence to describe their lives it would be "hard work day in and day out with absolutely no support from anyone." During school if anything I was discriminated against by the army of liberal female teachers who probably disliked the fact that I was a blond, white male, tallest in the class, bright and confident. I would love to find this secret world where white people somehow get benefits no one else gets because I think it's a lot of fantasy that liberals engage in to justify their inexplicable addiction to socialism which they manifest through AA.

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Although I agree almost completely with this statement, in almost any argument with people who think otherwise they will insert the "white privilage" argument. Try to argue that balck people are completely capeable of becoming successful on their own in our society with out the aid of things such as AA and they end up cursing you like you were insulting them.

kurto · #34 12-13-2006, 04:17 PM

Racism doesn't have to exist against all cultures equally. Not even sure why you would think that.

I don't pretend to understand why our country has held such negative feelings towards blacks for so long. I'm sure it has something to do with the fact that they were the predominant race that we enslaved. And they've been associated with civil strife in our country ever since. Also, they've been poor and unwanted pretty much since they were freed which has led to a number of problems.

kurto · #35 12-13-2006, 04:21 PM

Perhaps those positions were filled with minorities and yet still with the best?

There is no reason to assume your son is any better then the minorities.

Money2Burn · #36 12-13-2006, 04:41 PM

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Racism doesn't have to exist against all cultures equally. Not even sure why you would think that.

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Because of what racism is.

Racism

If we, as a society, believe our genetic differences make us superior as a race why would we discriminate between the other "inferior" races unequally?

Money2Burn · #37 12-13-2006, 04:42 PM

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Perhaps those positions were filled with minorities and yet still with the best?

There is no reason to assume your son is any better then the minorities.

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Because if they really had enough minorities who were over qualified to fill the "quota" then there would be no need for the quota in the first place.

AlexM · #38 12-13-2006, 05:18 PM

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Racism doesn't have to exist against all cultures equally. Not even sure why you would think that.

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Because of what racism is.

Racism

If we, as a society, believe our genetic differences make us superior as a race why would we discriminate between the other "inferior" races unequally?

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We as humans believe our species is superior to all other species, yet we don't treat cats the same as we treat mosquitoes. The "logic" for a racist being more and less racists to different races is pretty obvious really.

lehighguy · #39 12-13-2006, 06:20 PM

Yes, anyone that doesn't tow the line can't be a part of the club. Alert black god he's a heathen.

lehighguy · #40 12-13-2006, 06:21 PM

Only because we allow it. Only so many generations can continue to feel white guilt, eventually that gravy train runs dry after you dip into it too many times.