Person to person transfers

[Mike Cuneo]

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I just made payments to all 5 people I owe money to.
Please check your pokerstars accounts to double check

thank you all for your patience

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thanks, i actually appreciate that you are trying to make good on this debt. although what you did wasn't the best decision, at least you aren't running and keeping the money.

[EvilDruidNE]

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If you really want to stop scamming ban all paypal transfers. No serious poker player/nonscammer is going to trade paypal.



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Thanks.

I'm not sure that we have heard of one Paypal scam within this thread. That's not to say that there won't be one round the corner, and I am certainly not 100% au fait with Paypal rules, but I have been assuming people have been, say, selling and recording the sale of unique poems or paintings to the Paypal person to legitimise the payment and avoid later cancellation.

The alleged scams we have heard of have been simply that the person who received first supposedly didn't complete his part of the deal.

With regard to people's post counts and date of registration, I agree it seems likely that some people will join the site just to try a quick scam, but the vast majority are merely new to the pokerworld and this site, and I feel it is unfair to exclude them because of a few bad eggs in their "group". The long-time posters here should have the wit to ask the noobs to transfer first. The noobs should only deal with the long-timers. If noobs want to deal with noobs, then they need to take more care in obtaining full real life information; checking the other guy can sit at a table with the money involved; only transferring in small chunks; etc; etc.

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i agree, the current system seems fine. I am willing to send first to a known forum member for a low cash transfer, i dont know why people would want to ban this because ive only been on here for a month or so and i dont have many posts

[briton]

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If you really want to stop scamming ban all paypal transfers. No serious poker player/nonscammer is going to trade paypal.



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Thanks.

I'm not sure that we have heard of one Paypal scam within this thread. That's not to say that there won't be one round the corner, and I am certainly not 100% au fait with Paypal rules, but I have been assuming people have been, say, selling and recording the sale of unique poems or paintings to the Paypal person to legitimise the payment and avoid later cancellation.

The alleged scams we have heard of have been simply that the person who received first supposedly didn't complete his part of the deal.

With regard to people's post counts and date of registration, I agree it seems likely that some people will join the site just to try a quick scam, but the vast majority are merely new to the pokerworld and this site, and I feel it is unfair to exclude them because of a few bad eggs in their "group". The long-time posters here should have the wit to ask the noobs to transfer first. The noobs should only deal with the long-timers. If noobs want to deal with noobs, then they need to take more care in obtaining full real life information; checking the other guy can sit at a table with the money involved; only transferring in small chunks; etc; etc.

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Is there a way to block spammers and such. People who post on this thread things like "This thread is dumb and should be deleted" ect.

Thanx for your effort Mike,

briton

[Maulik]

Mike,

I have had a transaction on Papyal reversed. I urge all 2p2 not to do any paypal transactions. Transaction was reversed on Paypal by FTPplayer account p0kerpl4yer2007

[chicken10der]

That would be 2p2's very own englandpl20

[Clamper13]

Part I. Trading reliability versus post count/registration date.

A low post count and recent registration does warrant increased caution, but not automatically indicate the trustworthiness of a potential trading partner.

I think that that there are better ways to gauge a person's sincerity. Here is my top ten list, in no particular order.

Ask yourself these questions about your potential partner before engaging in any trade.

1. Are they unable to provide a verifiable history?
2. Do they insist on you trading first?
3. Do they refuse a small 'test' trade?
4. Are they in a hurry?
5. Do their online stats appear inconsistent with the amount of the trade?
6. Do they claim being already victimized?
7. Are there any inconsistencies in their statements?
8. Are they reluctant to provide information, ie. screen names on both sites, or show funds on the site that they will pay you from?
9. Does their forum name, player name(s), IM or email address show negative comments on this or any other forum?
10. Low post count and/or recent registration?

If you answer 'yes' to any one item on that list, proceed with extreme caution. If you answer 'yes' to more that one, then don't do the trade.

Part II. Paypal

I'm not a Paypal user, nor do I claim to be an expert, but here is the short version of what I gleaned from here:
http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr...ide#pbp-policy

A. Acceptable use policy
First, you need to know that Paypal will come down on you pretty hard if they discover that you are using their service in relation to a gambling site.


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10.5 Acceptable Use Policy Violation - User Fines. If you violate the Acceptable Use Policy as set forth below in clauses ...(c) below, then we may fine you $500.00 USD for each such violation...

c. Using the Service to receive payments for wagers, gambling debts or gambling winnings, regardless of the location or type of gambling activity.

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B. Disputes

The person sending funds on paypal has up to 45 days to dispute the transaction, but only for tangible goods.

An excerpt

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13.1 Buyer Protection Programs

These programs only cover payments for tangible, physical goods. All other payments, such as payments for intangibles, services, airline flight tickets, or licenses and other access to digital content are not covered by any Buyer Protection Program that we offer (but may be covered by Chargeback rights).

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C. Chargebacks

If the Paypal account is funded through a credit card, the person sending the funds can dispute the charge with the credit card company. The time limit is unclear, but could be weeks or months, depending on the issuing credit card company.

An excerpt:

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13.15 Relationship between PayPal Protection Programs and Chargeback Rights. The following information relates to reimbursement for losses from purchases where you used a credit card to fund a PayPal purchase:


Credit card chargeback rights, if they apply, are broader than PayPal Buyer Protection: among other things chargeback rights are not limited to $2,000.00 USD per transaction, can be filed more than 45 days after the transaction, and may cover unsatisfactory items even if they are not Significantly Not as Described.”

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See also here:
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/websc...isk-outside#Q3

An excerpt:
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Why do some chargebacks occur so long after a seller receives the payment?

Certain laws and credit card issuer policies usually allow buyers to file chargebacks weeks or sometimes months after the initial transaction occurs. If a buyer waits to file a chargeback, a seller may encounter a temporary hold on funds in their PayPal account for a transaction that occurred weeks or months ago.

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Summary

There is a risk $500.00 fine to the receiver in the event of discovery by Paypal. The sender may also be at risk.

I have not determined he likelihood of discovery.

I can imagine a scenario whereas the sender is unlikely to prevail in a dispute. It would entail that the funds are properly seasoned, and that the transfer is coded in such a way as to specifically state that the payment is for an intangible.

I don't have details on how to do that. Perhaps a Paypal veteran, or anybody currently offering Paypal would care to provide details.

In light of the methods disputing a payment, the potential fines from unauthorized use, the poor record of reliability in previous trades, and the lack of detailed information on how to mitigate the risks, I strongly recommend against accepting Paypal.

[Maulik]

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Mike,

I have had a transaction on Papyal reversed. I urge all 2p2 not to do any paypal transactions. Transaction was reversed on Paypal by FTPplayer account p0kerpl4yer2007

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That would be 2p2's very own englandpl20

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[Jeffmet3]

does anyone want UB money?

[pkrblog]

I am so sick of the anti-paypal threads.

People need to do their homework before commenting on it. It appears my longtime adversary clamper has done his research. He is indeed correct about the fine.

HOWEVER, reversing a paypal transaction is not as easy as people have you believe. You have to file a claim, and sign a sworn affidavit via online signature to complete the claim. If they notice that you are lying they can close your account and recommend prosecution for credit card fraud.

Paypal remains a safe alternative to transfer money to a friend, use for auctions, and even poker transfers if kept amongst friends.

[michaelantoi]

need ftp money

will pay party

$400 needed