The Mathematics of Poker

[bbbushu]

derosnec,

you sound VERY counter-exploitable

[img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
bbbushu

[derosnec]

i would be if my opponents had an IQ above 8

[sobefuddled]

You sound like the sort of player from whom I collect big stacks with nothing more than a well-timed bluff....Give someone enough rope and they hang themselves as the saying goes.

[derosnec]

i'm talking about cash games here. donkaments forum is that way

[skillzilla]

[ QUOTE ]
finished the book, though i haven't read this thread.

for NL cash (i play small stakes), experience is much more important than the math approach presented in this book.

after having played hundreds of thousands of hands of NL cash, i don't need math (beyond basic probability/odds) to make decisions. if i am the pfr and the caller leads small on the flop, they have a draw or marginal hand and will fold just about every time to a raise. if i raise pf, unless the opponent is shortstacked, a reraise is never AK/QQ or worse - they call with those hands. if someones minbets turn, they have a draw/marginal hand. if someone raises a three flush board on the river, they have the nuts or 2nd nuts. if i am the pfr and get check-raised on the flop or turn, my top pair (especially if it is a K high board) is no good. and so on. i don't use math for any of these because the scenarios keep repeating themselves.

so, i would definitely try to get as much experience as possible for NL rather than try to use the book's math approach of "opponent will bluff X% of the time here yet fold to a rebluff Y% of the time, so I have to win Z% of the time for it to be profitable." that appraoch is fine once in a blue moon against a tough player but for 99% of the hands, using hand reading that comes with experience is the way to go in my opinion.

[/ QUOTE ]

im not even half way through with the book but it explains in which way(and how) you can use math to get those notes/reads on players and how to employ an optimal strategy against it.

[derosnec]

you don't need to get reads/notes because 99% of the players at the small stakes (.25/.50 and below) play the same way.

besides most people dont stay at a table for more than 100 hands, meaning that any note/read you have is as valuable as a piece of kleenex. i mean if an opponent has seen 20 flops (which means she went to showdown probably 5 times, and probably most of those hands were in unraised pots), you're honestly going to tell me that on her 21st hand that you are going to have some great read as to what she has when you raise pf and and have top two pair on a KQ98 turn with 3 hearts?

[bbbushu]

derosnec,

you must have had very high expectations for the book!

just another way to get an extra edge, mang.

if it doesn't work for your game, then don't use it. you might not need math at the levels you're playing now but i'll bet it'll be pretty handy when you wanna move up.

good luck either way, i don't really care i just think it's a really good book and i wish i was smart enough to tap it for what it's worth [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

bbbushu

[sputum]

Do you feel the book was worth the purchase price?

[derosnec]

it is a very good book. im just saying that imho experience (which leads to instinct) is more valuable than math for nl cash. that has been my impression so far in my poker career.

[sobefuddled]

Does that mean you are offering a critique that would be valid for all players who wish to play micro-limit cash games for the remiander of their careers? Those players will not benefit from reading the book? What will happen to their game if they do read the book?