Cheating in Online Poker

[Clayton]

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I had said all along, and I said in the email to Stars, that I do not know whether Clayton cheated. All I know is that having many accounts in this day and age is extremely suspicious. I do not know Clayton, and have no reason to believe he either IS or is NOT cheating. All I know is that he had many accounts.

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You could have just kept this to AIM or asked one of the dozens of MTTC'ers that know me IRL that I would never do anything you fear such evidence would deem "suspicious", but instead you made the thread into something it wasn't. no longer was it about cheaters, but it was about people who've violated the jaywalking aspects of the TOC and villifying them.

i agree with jurollo that paul and whoever told paul i have a few accounts had every right to report me if they want to. what i dont agree with is having my reputation compromised on 2p2 when paul could have easily just kept this via AIM.

[MLG]

wow, this thread has gone insane in so many different ways. Some random points in no particular order.

1. I have no problem with ucla reporting clayton even though I wouldn't consider Clayton unethical at all.

2. I do have a problem with ucla trumpeting the fact that he did it, and the contentious way in which he did it.

3. It's absurd that people will say that we should all accept multi-accounting because there isnt anything we can do...and at the same time get on ucla for reporting clayton. Reporting cases like this is something we can do.

4. The fact is, you can't legislate intent. You can only legislate actions. There are a set of actions that are technically illegal that lots of people do, while those actions aren't always used for multi-accounting (in fact they arent the majority of the time), policing those actions more strictly is a way to make multi-accounting harder.

5. Accepting a situation (like Clayton having multiple accounts) because you trust the person is a disaster. Sure Clayton didnt multi-account, because he is a stand-up guy in that way, but it doesn't change the fact that it was incredibly easy for him to put himself in a situation where he could multi-account. And thats the core of the problem.

[Foucault]

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It's embarassing and the negative progress it has made is pretty sad.

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Still have not seen a single example of "Negative progress" or harm that's been done by this thread....

[uclabruinz]

Kleath and others,

I will say it one more time. I see no legit purpose for have 4-8 accounts or whatever Clayton had, particularly when he knows it's against he rules and knows all about the cloud of multiaccounting that hangs over online poker. As such, I felt obligation to report it to Stars, feeling that if he had done nothing wrong, he would be cleared and everything would be fine.

[Cat]

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kleath going to word this as nicely as possibly seriously leave this thread for those in the cliques because they know whats really going on.



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I think this statement is completely wrong. I've been playing online poker seriously for over 3 years, I've never been part of the high stakes MTT "clique". However, I still have an opinion on multiaccounting as do all other players. They should have every right to voice their opinion here. We need this issue brought to all players, not just the MTT clique, because for the past few months only the MTT clique has known about the prevalance of this problem, and haven't made much progress at all toward stopping it.

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yah you can have your opinions but they are more based on hearsay and your own inferences while most of those around each other have heard and seen a lot more and been asked to buy stacks sell stacks etc. And many other grey area things that go on daily esp on sundays.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jesus, Deeb you are an arrogant dickwad. Anyone is entitled to read and comment here, ESPECIALLY people out of your precious cliques since you clearly won't do anything about it yourself as you said earlier : "I don't want to turn in people I am friends with." [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

[NHFunkii]

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It's embarassing and the negative progress it has made is pretty sad.

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Still have not seen a single example of "Negative progress" or harm that's been done by this thread....

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seriously.
kleath and aspoker, calm down, this thread isn't going anywhere, and you're nuts (clayton too) if you think clayton is getting 'villified' here.

[EC10]

i think the fact that a bunch of tournament players coming together to discuss the issues at hand have resulted in this thread says a lot about how good of an idea ucla's original idea for publishing an article about "cheating in online poker" is.

[Clayton]

greg,

i'm just pissed i wasted 2 hours of perfectly good sandwich eating time thanks to paul trumpeting to everyone that clayton may or may not be a cheater, when he could have just kept it to PM's and AIM. that's all.

[uclabruinz]

ONCE AGAIN for Clayton, MLG and others,

I never OUTTED Clayton. Go back and reread my original post. I said I reported a well known 2p2er and multiple contributor to this thread. Maybe that was unnecessary, but I had ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA that anyone would assume this was Clayton.

Clayton, YOU could have kept your mouth shut, but you immediately came into this thread and said IT'S ME! So whatever this does to your reputation is completely self-inflicted.

[Clayton]

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i think the fact that a bunch of tournament players coming together to discuss the issues at hand have resulted in this thread says a lot about how good of an idea ucla's original idea for publishing an article about "cheating in online poker" is.

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qft