JJ: CO/Button confrontation against reg

[gimmetheloot]

Aditya, unless u are on some sort of level here....

Why do u say that u fold the turn but that the river we must stack off?

acevader i think ranges are ridiculous too.

[Acevader]

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All of those ranges are way way too wide IMO.

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You played the hand. What range do you put him on. Be realistic - regular or not this is NL$100. Don't forget how stupid some (most) of these players are. I play NL$200 and 20+ times a day I get 18/16-22/18 type 'regulars' calling my 3-bets and folding far more often that not to my c-bet. This is 100bb effective stacks when they don't have odds to play for a set or something of value with SC's. Are you telling me they always have AK and miss or 1010-QQ and there are overcards? I think not! Plenty, and I mean, PLENTY of these regulars are calling 3-bets with AK-A10, KQ, etc.

[Acevader]

[quoteacevader i think ranges are ridiculous too

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Lets see your ranges then? You are VERY quick to dismiss other peoples logic and thinking but not once have you gone through this hand logically including and dimissing hands to come up with a final realistic range (as you see it). I want to see your range and want to see justification for why that range is probably and THEN I want you to stove it and show me that hero doesn't have the odds.

Also, FWIW, you advocate the turn call is fine but then say he has to fold the river. I can't see how the range you view as probably changes enough on the river king to turn a clear turn call into a clear river fold with such lucrative odds.

....and finally! If I'm wrong and this regular is soooooooooooooooo good as to never have a lesser hand here like an A10, etc then please, please, please tell me how he isn't good enough to realize that in value terms there is no difference between his river bet and his river push and thus he is denying himself extra value. He can't be THAT good!?

[loosbastard]

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You played the hand. What range do you put him on. Be realistic - regular or not this is NL$100. Don't forget how stupid some (most) of these players are. I play NL$200 and 20+ times a day I get 18/16-22/18 type 'regulars' calling my 3-bets and folding far more often that not to my c-bet. This is 100bb effective stacks when they don't have odds to play for a set or something of value with SC's. Are you telling me they always have AK and miss or 1010-QQ and there are overcards? I think not! Plenty, and I mean, PLENTY of these regulars are calling 3-bets with AK-A10, KQ, etc.

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I'm not saying they always have TT+/AK here. "Regs" call 3-bets all day w/ small pairs and occasionally some other garbage. I don't know all that much about this particular player, but he doesn't seem retarded...so I'm thinking his range is something like. Sets/QQ+ and occasionally something weird like 78s. He sometimes shows up w/ big hearts here (although I think he's generally C/R'ing flop)...but now I can't even beat that.

[loosbastard]

I was thinking something more along the lines of this:

Board: Td 8h 5h 8c Kc
Dead:

Hand 0: 22.059% { JcJh }
Hand 1: 77.941% { 88+, 55, AhKh, AhQh, KhQh, 87s }

And that's being generous in assuming he sometimes turns 99 into a bluff (which I don't think he's doing that often at all).

[aditya]

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Aditya, unless u are on some sort of level here....

Why do u say that u fold the turn but that the river we must stack off?

acevader i think ranges are ridiculous too.

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I don't think I ever said what we must do on the river but I thought it was implied cause if I'm folding turn I'm obviously folding river.

[loosbastard]

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I don't think I ever said what we must do on the river but I thought it was implied cause if I'm folding turn I'm obviously folding river.

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I'd think we need a pretty ridiculous read to just fold turn.

[gimmetheloot]

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[ QUOTE ]
Aditya, unless u are on some sort of level here....

Why do u say that u fold the turn but that the river we must stack off?

acevader i think ranges are ridiculous too.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think I ever said what we must do on the river but I thought it was implied cause if I'm folding turn I'm obviously folding river.

[/ QUOTE ]

Didnt realize uw ere saying stack off with AA/KK.

[dragonystic]

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shove turn.

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And get called by what?

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taking the pot down at this point is perfectly fine.

[aditya]

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I don't think I ever said what we must do on the river but I thought it was implied cause if I'm folding turn I'm obviously folding river.

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I'd think we need a pretty ridiculous read to just fold turn.

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Why? What exactly are you beating? His donk bet on the turn is sooo strong.