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#21
08-17-2007, 05:42 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
This is kind of a deep concept so it takes a little bit to grab on to. I will try to explain it. [/ QUOTE ] Well, I guess I understand the concept in general, but there is one problem I see: Say we donīt want to get all-in. We want to see the flop, and especially see if we find an Ace or a King. Thatīs why we make a smaller reraise. Now, villain sees our 3-bet and he puts us on say AA-JJ, AK or something like that like. We have a problem: as our reraise is small, and there is a lot of money behind (we are talking about deep stacks), villain can now call with any pocket pair for set value and is correct to do so, or close to it. Now the flop comes A-x-y, the pot is still small but not very small. He might have a set. We bet. He calls. We now have the same so-so inbetween problem we have if we make a "wrong" medium sized 3-bet. Is this better than the risk of getting all-in before the flop, if a large preflop 3-bet can fold out medium/small pocket pairs? Is there any flaw in my reasoning? Thank you. 
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#23
08-17-2007, 05:45 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
As for the preflop hand range of 4-bet shoving villains,
[ QUOTE ] they show up with AK, JJ other random junk more than enough to get allin [/ QUOTE ] I agree to that. I put him on AA,KK,AK (less likely than normal because Hero has AK) QQ,JJ (JJ is a little bit less likely) Also, 10% of the time you see AQ and the occasional A9o.
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#24
08-17-2007, 05:48 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Say we donīt want to get all-in. [/ QUOTE ] don't reraise see that was simple [/ QUOTE ] Thanks, but I specifically wanted to discuss the concept that treads13 presented.
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#25
08-17-2007, 06:02 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
Hand 1: I dont see the point in 3 betting and folding to a shove at these levels. If you dont want too be put to a decision for all your chips dont re-raise him. As played i shove here i shove all the time.
Hand 2: I'd probaly just flat call his raise. As played i dont really have a clue what to do.
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#26
08-17-2007, 06:04 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] At these limits you will very rarely see some cat play a wider range than QQ+ [/ QUOTE ] lol you're really off on this its an easy call [/ QUOTE ] I didn't play much at these levels, so I can be wrong on that. The general theory holds true though.
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#27
08-17-2007, 06:06 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Say we donīt want to get all-in. [/ QUOTE ] don't reraise see that was simple [/ QUOTE ] I said that was an option. You cut my part where I said that out. What point are you trying to prove?
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#28
08-17-2007, 06:09 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] This is kind of a deep concept so it takes a little bit to grab on to. I will try to explain it. [/ QUOTE ] Well, I guess I understand the concept in general, but there is one problem I see: Say we donīt want to get all-in. We want to see the flop, and especially see if we find an Ace or a King. Thatīs why we make a smaller reraise. Now, villain sees our 3-bet and he puts us on say AA-JJ, AK or something like that like. We have a problem: as our reraise is small, and there is a lot of money behind (we are talking about deep stacks), villain can now call with any pocket pair for set value and is correct to do so, or close to it. Now the flop comes A-x-y, the pot is still small but not very small. He might have a set. We bet. He calls. We now have the same so-so inbetween problem we have if we make a "wrong" medium sized 3-bet. Is this better than the risk of getting all-in before the flop, if a large preflop 3-bet can fold out medium/small pocket pairs? Is there any flaw in my reasoning? Thank you. [/ QUOTE ] You said there is a lot of money behind after we 3-bet. If we 3-bet there isn't a lot of money behind. Even if it is a min-raise we are forcing him to put in ~1/7 of his stack. If he is in there with a small PP he won't make a set and us get stacked often enough for him to profit.
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#29
08-17-2007, 06:27 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: I dont see the point in 3 betting and folding to a shove at these levels. If you dont want too be put to a decision for all your chips dont re-raise him. As played i shove here i shove all the time. Hand 2: I'd probaly just flat call his raise. As played i dont really have a clue what to do. [/ QUOTE ] On Hand 1, I agree, at NL10 I think you have to make your basic strategy to get people to overcommit after the flop. I think reraising preflop OOP without a big made hand is a bad idea in general at this level. Most of these players have no plays other than shoving (pre-flop and post-flop), reraising just allows them to make this play.
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#30
08-17-2007, 06:32 PM
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Re: NL10 Playing AK from BB in raised pots is difficult
[ QUOTE ]
You said there is a lot of money behind after we 3-bet. If we 3-bet there isn't a lot of money behind. Even if it is a min-raise we are forcing him to put in ~1/7 of his stack. If he is in there with a small PP he won't make a set and us get stacked often enough for him to profit. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, you are right. I didnīt realize it is that much compared to his stack. Thanks.
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