33 in the BB...

[secretprankster]

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With his opening range if I just call pretty much any card higher than an 8 could hit his hand

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Not only can this obv. happen if you 3-bet, but if you 3-bet he'll likely peel the flop and maybe the turn too - giving him more chances to hit. 3-betting has advantages (like he has 77, you 3-bet and he checkfolds a KQJ flop) but being in position with a hand I want to show down most of the time, I'd prefer to just call.

[yourface]

another thing to think about is that if you take the lead preflop he can raise you postflop as a bluff or semibluff and you will usually have to fold

[thepizzlefosho]

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another thing to think about is that if you take the lead preflop he can raise you postflop as a bluff or semibluff and you will usually have to fold

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this makes a lot of sense. so is this simply a hand that we should just call down the whole way on every mildly safe board? (I've been playing a lot of HU lately so that may be affecting my view on this)

[Apanage]

I seldom find myself to the left of a TAG. But I like 3-betting preflop.
I don´t think you should underestimate the importance of creating an image in BB where SB villains have to shrink their preflop open raising ranges because they cannot afford to get 3-bet.

[Oink]

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another thing to think about is that if you take the lead preflop he can raise you postflop as a bluff or semibluff and you will usually have to fold

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This makes a lot of sense. so is this simply a hand that we should just call down the whole way on every mildly safe board? (I've been playing a lot of HU lately so that may be affecting my view on this)

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The fact that hero will fold incorrectly on AKT flops is just as much a problem when Hero just calls preflop. Although in a smaller pot than if 3-bet pre

I like what jba is saying but he is considering the hand in a vacuum. A lot of tough players will open a lot from the SB. Some will open 60-70 even 80%. I think its important to 3-bet very liberally to discourange them from raising that much.

I definetely 3-bet 33 against some opponents in position but IMO its not the only way to play the hand. It really depends on villain.

EDIT: Apanage that swedish bastard beat me to it.

[Oink]

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Just out of curiosity, if you call here pre (I do) what is the cutoff for flops you fold right away on?

For me personally I think I would be folding the flop if it has 3 broadways with no pair or is something like a JT9 monotone. What else, if anything?

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This is a good question. Flops like AKJ and QJ9 are folds. AK5 is probably a fold too. Its the flops like A94 and KJ2 that im unsure about.

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Against opponents who is a bit weak I am not folding any of those flops. Floating high card flops will be a good play against TAGs that give up on the turn

[jba]

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I don´t think you should underestimate the importance of creating an image in BB where SB villains have to shrink their preflop open raising ranges because they cannot afford to get 3-bet.

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that depends on whether or not a 3bet with 33 is good in the first place. if the bb will 3bet with 100% of hands my opening range will be wider than normal, not narrower. it just means I need to showdown more.

[MacGuyV]

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fyi if I'm raising the turn i'm usually betting the river.

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Without question. "Call cause Ace high pays off anyways" sounds like an ok reason not to check 5th st but not much of a reason to call 4th.

[Apanage]

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I don´t think you should underestimate the importance of creating an image in BB where SB villains have to shrink their preflop open raising ranges because they cannot afford to get 3-bet.

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that depends on whether or not a 3bet with 33 is good in the first place. if the bb will 3bet with 100% of hands my opening range will be wider than normal, not narrower. it just means I need to showdown more.

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That seems like a losing proposition to me. That means you have to showdown UI J and Q-high hands. Assuming equal playing standards you can be pretty sure that you´re going to lose at least 0.5 BB more when behind than when you´re ahead almost always.
If you´re open raising 50% of your hands and get 3-bet by a 70% range from BB I can not imagine that playing a wider range would be profitable. A majority of time the flop will hit neither of you.The hands you´re adding will not play well if you don´t hit the flop so there is no value to add them for showdown value purposes.

[thepizzlefosho]

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fyi if I'm raising the turn i'm usually betting the river.

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Without question. "Call cause Ace high pays off anyways" sounds like an ok reason not to check 5th st but not much of a reason to call 4th.

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so you are saying you would raise this turn, and then bet any non-A river?