Do I have the nuts, or is is possible he has me beat?

[FishSticks]

Tough call. Reads sure would help.

The guy open limped on the button. Given the way the hand played out, I think he either open limped on the button with baby clubs, or he open limped with a big pair like KK to try to "trap". Either way he's probably not that great.

If he has baby clubs, who knows if he can fold. He likely has worse than the 2nd nut flush (given no flop bet from the Kc), so I think even bad players could find a fold to a river push given the action, but who knows, bad players do bad things.

He's obv not folding if he slowplayed something big and has a boat.

The value in a shove over the baby flush is there to a degree but questionable, but the chance you're beat coupled with him being able to fold a baby flush here makes this a flat call.

[Fonkey123]

Call. I think value shoving is too thin here.

[rakes.a.beach]

[ QUOTE ]
My real question is, whould we shove or flat call? Is it likely he has a full house more often than he has a straight or flush?

[/ QUOTE ]

shoving is pretty bad... you're going to be 4betting river. Straights aren't calling. a stubborn flush is all that will call. I think call is by far the best option here.

[Imrahil]

Do you guys know villain checked behind on the flop and closed the action on the turn by calling? I can't imagine him having a boat here very often. This is a flush a lot of the time.

[aislephive]

Obviously call. I'd almost rather fold than shove.

[EddieRooo]

I think this is pretty tough, esp with no read on the button.

I just call I think. He has 3bet cold... I'm not sure I see him doing that with a baby flush that often.

I think his hand is either a flush or a full house. I think if you push a baby flush may fold, so I think you are only really getting called by a K (or maybe J high) flush, imo I think this makes value pushing -ev.

With no reads I assume he isn't bad enough to think you are raising 3 tens the first time so I just call.

[4_2_it]

Hero's hand is pretty transparent as either a flush or busted draw. No way I'd shove here because only a boat is looking him up. Villain's line is weird unless he had 77 so I'd probably pay him off expecting to see a worse flush a lot more often then 77.

[Tickner]

u guys dont think a flush will call my 4bet? seriously?

[Imrahil]

I think a flush is calling a 4bet all the time.

[Jay Riall]

Eugh, I misread the hand and thought you got bet-3bet by the same guy. I probably shove because his hand looks like a flush.