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#21
05-01-2007, 11:02 AM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I don't know what I am doing. What does all of this mean? What should I do? Position Event Series Market Position Date -55 AMERICANIDOL-2007 PHIL STACEY(44577) 1 - 3 04/29/2007 17:37:28 -25 AMERICANIDOL-2007 CHRIS RICHARDSON(44565) 0 - 2 04/24/2007 16:41:52 15 AMERICANIDOL-2007 MELINDA DOOLITTLE(44573) 34 - 39 04/30/2007 16:03:17 [/ QUOTE ] I believe they already debited your account for Chris and Phil which means if neither of them win you will get back 5500 for Phil and 2500 for Chris but I am not certain of this. [/ QUOTE ] Ah . . . no . . . what this means is that if Phil goes out you would get back 55 x $1 or $55. I'm pretty sure they haven't debited your account because you wouldn't have enough in there to cover it. To short Phil you would basically be wagering $99 to win $1. 55 shares x $99 = way more than is in your account I would assume. The Chris one didn't go through because he is already at 0. You can't short him if his sell price is already at 0. [ QUOTE ] You should call WSEX to clarify all of this. 888-498-8227 [/ QUOTE ] This is very good advice. Call them. 
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#22
05-01-2007, 11:42 AM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
I'm one of the moderators of this forum. You made minor, but unnecessary, sexist remarks, imo, which I deleted. Nothing of value to the debate was removed. [/ QUOTE ] I remember now what I said. I simply commented on the anatomy of the avatars of two of the members. It was not a negative or sexist comment. You may have considered it inappropriate but clearly it wasn't sexist. I do not now nor do I ever make sexist remarks. In no way were my comments discriminatory toward anyone.
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#23
05-01-2007, 11:51 AM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I don't know what I am doing. What does all of this mean? What should I do? Position Event Series Market Position Date -55 AMERICANIDOL-2007 PHIL STACEY(44577) 1 - 3 04/29/2007 17:37:28 -25 AMERICANIDOL-2007 CHRIS RICHARDSON(44565) 0 - 2 04/24/2007 16:41:52 15 AMERICANIDOL-2007 MELINDA DOOLITTLE(44573) 34 - 39 04/30/2007 16:03:17 [/ QUOTE ] I believe they already debited your account for Chris and Phil which means if neither of them win you will get back 5500 for Phil and 2500 for Chris but I am not certain of this. [/ QUOTE ] Ah . . . no . . . what this means is that if Phil goes out you would get back 55 x $1 or $55. I'm pretty sure they haven't debited your account because you wouldn't have enough in there to cover it. To short Phil you would basically be wagering $99 to win $1. 55 shares x $99 = way more than is in your account I would assume. The Chris one didn't go through because he is already at 0. You can't short him if his sell price is already at 0. [ QUOTE ] You should call WSEX to clarify all of this. 888-498-8227 [/ QUOTE ] This is very good advice. Call them. [/ QUOTE ] If he doesn't have enough to be taken out then assuming it is a post up account what happens if he loses? No offense but that makes no sense at all. I have shorted at WSEX before and the way it works is if you are shorting something at say 34. They give you 34 dollars in your account and then freeze 100. This way if the short holds up they give you back your 100 and you netted 34. If your short doesn't work then they take the 100 that was frozen and you have a net loss of 66.
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#24
05-01-2007, 11:53 AM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks, vegan. They have not taken the money out of my account. If you were me, would you keep it how it is or would you buy back any shares? [/ QUOTE ] I replied to the other thread about this but since the discussion seems to be here... You can't short on WSEX unless you have enough to cover your potential loss if the person wins. And yes they do take the money out of your account when you make the short sale. So if you shorted 55 Phils at 1-3 that means you sold 55 shares at $1, which means $5445 (55*99) would be taken from your account. Then when Phil gets eliminated you'd get $5500 credited back to your account. So you're risking $5445 to win $55. At any rate if you closed your short position on Phil now it would cost you $3 a share so you'd lose $110 total. Might as well wait until he mercifully gets eliminated finally.
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#25
05-01-2007, 12:06 PM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Thanks, vegan. They have not taken the money out of my account. If you were me, would you keep it how it is or would you buy back any shares? [/ QUOTE ] I replied to the other thread about this but since the discussion seems to be here... You can't short on WSEX unless you have enough to cover your potential loss if the person wins. And yes they do take the money out of your account when you make the short sale. So if you shorted 55 Phils at 1-3 that means you sold 55 shares at $1, which means $5445 (55*99) would be taken from your account. Then when Phil gets eliminated you'd get $5500 credited back to your account. So you're risking $5445 to win $55. At any rate if you closed your short position on Phil now it would cost you $3 a share so you'd lose $110 total. Might as well wait until he mercifully gets eliminated finally. [/ QUOTE ] I was all but certain that what I said was accurate and it is. I even called WSEX to confirm.
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#26
05-01-2007, 01:15 PM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
I was all but certain that what I said was accurate and it is. I even called WSEX to confirm. [/ QUOTE ] Not sure what you think you were accurate on but revots33 explained it correctly. You said this: [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I don't know what I am doing. What does all of this mean? What should I do? Position Event Series Market Position Date -55 AMERICANIDOL-2007 PHIL STACEY(44577) 1 - 3 04/29/2007 17:37:28 -25 AMERICANIDOL-2007 CHRIS RICHARDSON(44565) 0 - 2 04/24/2007 16:41:52 15 AMERICANIDOL-2007 MELINDA DOOLITTLE(44573) 34 - 39 04/30/2007 16:03:17 [/ QUOTE ] I believe they already debited your account for Chris and Phil which means if neither of them win you will get back 5500 for Phil and 2500 for Chris but I am not certain of this. If you want to cash these positions at the above prices you would need to buy 55 shares of Phil and 25 of Chris. This will end your positions if you want. As for Melinda, you own 15 shares. If she wins you will get 1500. If you want to cash on her you can sell your 15 shares at the market price. Remember the small number is the sell price and the large number is the buy price. You should call WSEX to clarify all of this. 888-498-8227 [/ QUOTE ] You were correct that he would get back $5500 and $2500 when Phil and Chris were eliminated. What you didn't say was that to do that, he would have had to wager $5445 and $2500 respectively. I'm pretty sure this guy didn't have $8000+ in his WSEX account and I'm pretty sure that this guy wouldn't risk $99 per share of Phil to win $1. So if you knew all that and just failed to mention it then yes . . . I guess you were correct.
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#27
05-01-2007, 01:48 PM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I was all but certain that what I said was accurate and it is. I even called WSEX to confirm. [/ QUOTE ] Not sure what you think you were accurate on but revots33 explained it correctly. You said this: [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I don't know what I am doing. What does all of this mean? What should I do? Position Event Series Market Position Date -55 AMERICANIDOL-2007 PHIL STACEY(44577) 1 - 3 04/29/2007 17:37:28 -25 AMERICANIDOL-2007 CHRIS RICHARDSON(44565) 0 - 2 04/24/2007 16:41:52 15 AMERICANIDOL-2007 MELINDA DOOLITTLE(44573) 34 - 39 04/30/2007 16:03:17 [/ QUOTE ] I believe they already debited your account for Chris and Phil which means if neither of them win you will get back 5500 for Phil and 2500 for Chris but I am not certain of this. If you want to cash these positions at the above prices you would need to buy 55 shares of Phil and 25 of Chris. This will end your positions if you want. As for Melinda, you own 15 shares. If she wins you will get 1500. If you want to cash on her you can sell your 15 shares at the market price. Remember the small number is the sell price and the large number is the buy price. You should call WSEX to clarify all of this. 888-498-8227 [/ QUOTE ] You were correct that he would get back $5500 and $2500 when Phil and Chris were eliminated. What you didn't say was that to do that, he would have had to wager $5445 and $2500 respectively. I'm pretty sure this guy didn't have $8000+ in his WSEX account and I'm pretty sure that this guy wouldn't risk $99 per share of Phil to win $1. So if you knew all that and just failed to mention it then yes . . . I guess you were correct. [/ QUOTE ] He didn't say he made these wagers at this market. I don't know what he wagered. I wouldn't even hazard a guess. He asked for an explanation and everything I said in it's entirety is exactly correct. I don't know what price he shorted at but as I said for each share he shorted at they would add the sell price to his balance and then freeze 100 for each share as well. Just call WSEX and they will confirm this.
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#28
05-01-2007, 02:11 PM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I was all but certain that what I said was accurate and it is. I even called WSEX to confirm. [/ QUOTE ] Not sure what you think you were accurate on but revots33 explained it correctly. You said this: [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I don't know what I am doing. What does all of this mean? What should I do? Position Event Series Market Position Date -55 AMERICANIDOL-2007 PHIL STACEY(44577) 1 - 3 04/29/2007 17:37:28 -25 AMERICANIDOL-2007 CHRIS RICHARDSON(44565) 0 - 2 04/24/2007 16:41:52 15 AMERICANIDOL-2007 MELINDA DOOLITTLE(44573) 34 - 39 04/30/2007 16:03:17 [/ QUOTE ] I believe they already debited your account for Chris and Phil which means if neither of them win you will get back 5500 for Phil and 2500 for Chris but I am not certain of this. If you want to cash these positions at the above prices you would need to buy 55 shares of Phil and 25 of Chris. This will end your positions if you want. As for Melinda, you own 15 shares. If she wins you will get 1500. If you want to cash on her you can sell your 15 shares at the market price. Remember the small number is the sell price and the large number is the buy price. You should call WSEX to clarify all of this. 888-498-8227 [/ QUOTE ] You were correct that he would get back $5500 and $2500 when Phil and Chris were eliminated. What you didn't say was that to do that, he would have had to wager $5445 and $2500 respectively. I'm pretty sure this guy didn't have $8000+ in his WSEX account and I'm pretty sure that this guy wouldn't risk $99 per share of Phil to win $1. So if you knew all that and just failed to mention it then yes . . . I guess you were correct. [/ QUOTE ] the part you said he was correct on was actualy the part he was incorrect he would not get 5500 + 2500 he would get 0 + 5500 or 3000 + 2500 depending on the order they go and he would not have to wager 8000+ he would only need to wager 5420 assuming he sold them both at 1
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#29
05-01-2007, 03:00 PM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
This is the most complicated explanation of shorting I've ever heard. No wonder traffic1234 is confused; I am too, after reading this thread, and I've been using the WSEX markets for 3 seasons. AFAIK revots' post is accurate, and most closely reflects the way I have it written in the FAQ. If anyone would like to post a step-by-step guide to shorting I would be glad to include it in the FAQ with credit to the writer, of course.
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#30
05-01-2007, 03:38 PM
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Re: WTF WSEX FROZE MARKETS ALREADY???
Im am absolutely terrible at explaining things but Ill try.
Shorting - Selling shares of a contestant you do not own. Example Blake is at 10-13 so if you short him you risk $90 to win $10 and $90 will be debited from your account when Blake is eliminated you get back $100 note you must buy back the shares at $1 you are actually paying $0 because he is priced 0 - 0 so if you short 10 blakes at 10 $900 will be taken from your account when blake is elliminated you get $1000 back, if you buy blake back at $13 you get $100-13 $87 will be credited back to your account Margins using traffic1234 as an example If you short 55 phils at 1 $5445 will be taken from your account so you are risking $5445 to win $55 If you now short 25 Chris at 1 $25 will be added to your account nothing will be taken because there can only be one winner so If phil goes first $3000 will be added back to your account when Chris goes $2500 will be added back to your account If Chris goes first you get nothing, but when Phil goes you get $5500 added back to your account Assuming traffic1234 sold Chris and Phil at 1 He risked $5420 to win $80 assuming he sold Phil and Chris at 1-3 and bought melinda at 34-39 (looking at his post you can figure out these are the prices paid) If Phil Wins he loses 15*39 and 55*99 but wins 25*1 = -6005 If Chris Wins he loses 15*39 and 25*99 but wins 55*1 = -3005 If Melinda Wins he wins all bets 15*61 + 80*1 = +995 If anyone else wins he loses 15*39 and wins 80*1 = -505
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