AAAAAAAAARGH!

[kerowo]

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So in this case there is only one card that beats you? It is not possible he limped with T2s? or JJ+?

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yes its possible. There were other combinations of cards in the other hand that could have beaten me as well.

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sigh. Yes, short of having the mortal nuts there are always hands that can beat you. However, they are not always likely and the strength of your hand determines how likely it is. AA is a very strong holding on a raggy board when it's been raised preflop. 2nd pair not so much. I'm not sure why you constantly think someone has the nuts against you yet continue to call down. Your action doesn't match your reads.

[Befolder]

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I'm not sure why you constantly think someone has the nuts against you yet continue to call down. Your action doesn't match your reads.

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It's call the progression of a poker player. I went through this phase myself.

[bravos1]

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Just curious, why the preflop raise?

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yes, looking back , preflop raise was stupid. my thinking was, "noone has raised, i have a decent hand, get more money in"
[img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

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I would guess here that Boz is not saying that the raise is bad.... he is probably just asking why you raised. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Sometimes it helps to talk things out.

[neeeel]

I dont continue to call down , i fold,( or else i think they *may* not have me beat , and call down) and apparently this is wrong in some situations and not others. I dont know how to distinguish the situations where it is right to call down , and the ones where it isnt. In the 2 hands in this post, and the one earlier with AA, I have a good hand, that is threatened by possible other hands. Im at a total loss. All the hands seem similar to me, though some are stronger than others.

[Faze]

[newbiespew]

I'm sure you already understand, but to me it's worth consciously recognizing Overpair >> TPTK > TPGK >>> MPTP. If I had to make an imaginary break on hand strength in full ring, ignoring all other factors which you can't, I would say that anything less than top pair is no good ... minus reads ... and steal situations ... ok, fine. "It depends"

[/newbiespew]

[bozlax]

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Just curious, why the preflop raise?

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yes, looking back , preflop raise was stupid. my thinking was, "noone has raised, i have a decent hand, get more money in"
[img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

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I would guess here that Boz is not saying that the raise is bad.... he is probably just asking why you raised. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Sometimes it helps to talk things out.

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So-crates rules. Bravos hit the nail on the head.

Neeeel, if that was really the sum total of your thinking then the pfr was stupid. Now, to continue the seminar, what thinking would make a pfr NOT stupid? (Hint: a pfr shouldn't be your default, probably.)

[neeeel]

i have to admit i am shocking at reads. I can pick out a really bad player, that plays almost every hand, and always stays to the SD, and i can tell a player who is a bit loose, all the rest just sort of blend into an amorphous mass. So having said that, maybe I should read them as typical players, and accept that my mid pair is hardly ever going to be good enough against a raise.

[neeeel]

"what thinking would make a pfr NOT stupid?"

ummmmmmmmmmm, showing strength preflop in order to take control of the pot and maybe stealing on the flop?

[Buzz-cp]

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ok heres another one


Party Poker 0.50/1.00 Hold'em <font color="#0000FF">(10 handed)</font> link

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, SB calls, <font color="#666666">1 folds</font>.

Flop: (5.00 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, SB calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">SB raises</font>, Hero ????

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standard calldown

[bozlax]

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i have to admit i am shocking at reads. I can pick out a really bad player, that plays almost every hand, and always stays to the SD, and i can tell a player who is a bit loose, all the rest just sort of blend into an amorphous mass.

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Dude, you need to work on this. fwiw, my dog can spot a 93/2/0.1 with a WTSD of 80.