NL 200 5-handed: AA, horrible board, 4 players in the pot

[ChooseJif]

I'm not disrespecting the posters that have already chimed in. I think everyone has made some good points. In fact i've been swayed a bit.

I just think it's a tough spot and deserves some more discussion.

[ValarMorghulis]

"If he's passive then why would you put him on a draw when he bets the flop? The OP described him as a loose, calling station. Not many calling stations bet their draws.

Also, if a passive actually does bet the flop and you just call he might figure his KJ is good and put out a bigger bet on the turn."

There's a big difference between betting half pot on the flop when no one has shown any strength to betting strongly on the turn when called on the flop by two people.

Yep, if we fold on the turn we still might fold the best hand if he overplays TPGK, but we might also fold the best hand if we raise on the flop and he re-raises his KJ allin.

If you think there's a good chance that he'll overplay TPTK or a draw then re-raise allin on the turn when a blank hits is much better than getting it in on the flop. Your equity is much better against a draw and you know if button or BB are really interested in the hand (I'm assuming button folds to flop bet and BB folds to turn bet) before committing yourself to the pot.

[ChooseJif]

"There's a big difference between betting half pot on the flop when no one has shown any strength to betting strongly on the turn when called on the flop by two people."

He's leading out into the preflop aggressor with 4 in the hand. If this player is in fact passive, I think this should be taken as a sign of strength. That is why I feel like it is a fold or raise situation.

From the OP's post I get the feeling that his player is more loose than passive, though. It's a tough spot.

[CallYNotRaise06]

wow this sucks, i really cant decide between raise or fold. Calling sucks..... i fold. your either close to even $ or [censored].

[Psydoc]

This looks like it's leaning toward a fold for me, although I might call while sitting there staring at my AA. I think a raise is not good here...

[Eyeback]

Given the description of the BB and SB you cant really fold here. You are missing too much value. I would call if I was closing the action but then you will be giving the decent button too good odds. A raise to about 60 seems right. BB probably has 1-pair or a draw and SB just betting half the pot isnt showing that much strenght. He might be protecting a weaker hand or being on a draw himself. I will fold to a push as these players arent pushing draws.

If both SB and BB calls you are in trouble and probably behind. I would try to get to showdown for free and will fold if they bet into you (either on turn or river). If one of them folds and one calls I will push any non [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] non 7 non Q turn. A 9 is tricky cause 9+pair is a likely and giving them 2p.

Its a tricky spot and if button joins in on the action I wouldnt invest more money into the pot.

[Eyeback]

Though folding is not awfull and might save you some headache but I think you are ahead most of the time here.

[goofyballer]

I think calling has a little bit of merit in that it gives Hero a cheap opportunity to see a turn card; if it's a [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]/9/Q/7, Hero can safely get away from any action. If it's a blank, Hero can re-evaluate based on villain's actions; SB would probably be reluctant to put in another 1/2 pot+ bet if he only has a draw, as the pot is now much bigger. I think I like calling better than folding, actually.

[Dan Bitel]

Calling isn't bad here. lets us see the turn and evaluate from there. This is definitely NOT a fold or raise situation (and when ppl say that a situation is raise or fold, they are usually wrong)

That said, raising is still better than calling. I'm making a near pot sized raise here and looking to felt it vs any1 except BTN

[Eyeback]

If the BB would have fold I think this goes from a raise to a call. When he's there I'm more inclined to a raise though and hopefully take it down right here.