Requesting to see mucked cards at showdown?

[Dangeresque]

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This was something I never understood. Online, you get to see everything at showdown.

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You realize that live poker was around before online poker, right?

-McGee

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And online it's a horrible rule too. IMO

[Ignignokt]

Speaking of which, last night at Muckleshoot people were CONSTANTLY whining "I want to see both hands" after being raised off a hand, when someone checkraised someone else, or just because they were curious.

Some dealers manually flipped over the mucked losing hand, others left it up to the player to show. Personally it didn't matter to me because every time I was in a hand and someone demanded it, I had the winner at showdown, but still an awful state of affairs.

[Dagger78]

Thanks for the link. I'm apparently too dumb to find anything out on my own.

Next post is sure to be about hookers and blow.

[Jive Dadson]

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Varies by casino.

Usually, only players involved in the hand at showdown may ask to see a called hand.

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That doesn't make any sense. A player who has been raised out of the pot is most likely to suspect collusion. Futhermore, anyone who is going to play in the next pot, and the next, has an interest in knowing if the game is on the up-and-up, not just those who were in at the showdown of this pot.

It's a stupid rule, because it doesn't even do much to prevent collusion. Either the rule should be dropped, or the rule should be all hands in a showdown must always show, whether anyone asks or not. I would prefer the rule be abandoned.

[Don Olney]

I do not care for anyone asking to see a hand.
But hey, 99.9999999% that ask to see the hands at show down have no idea what to do with the information anyway.

[Wongboy]

If someone asks to see your hand at showdown, they are accusing you of cheating. You should respond in the same manner as if they had said "you sir are a dirty scumbag cheater". In other words -

- If the statement comes from a small, nerdy, nit, then call them out, tell them to f-off and ask if they want to take it outside.

- If the statement comes from a 360 pound guy with 3 tatoos on his face, then flip your cards over politely and offer to buy him a beer.

- If the statement comes from a hot chick, then throw out a drunken pick up line (I'm assuming you are drunk at this point because hot chicks do not play poker and you are really mistaking a 2 for a 10).

- If the statement comes from a complete fish, just be quiet as you don't want to do anything that might cause the fish to leave.

[Ignignokt]

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If someone asks to see your hand at showdown, they are accusing you of cheating.

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Bum-bum-pa-bumm...waaaaaaaaa (sound of losing at "The Price is Right")

The correct answer is "they don't have any idea what they're doing, just like always."

But we'll see you in the Showcase Showdown.

[Wongboy]

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If someone asks to see your hand at showdown, they are accusing you of cheating.

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Bum-bum-pa-bumm...waaaaaaaaa (sound of losing at "The Price is Right")

The correct answer is "they don't have any idea what they're doing, just like always."

But we'll see you in the Showcase Showdown.

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I should have clarified my statement above. They are accusing you of cheating, but they likely have no idea that this is what they are actually saying. Kind of like if someone says "hey, are you two guys sharing card information", but they have no idea that this is actually cheating. Another example that holds true at a low limit table is when I check-raise the turn and the calling station in seat 4 honestly has no idea that I just said I have a big hand.

[PokerSlut]

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- If the statement comes from a hot chick, then throw out a drunken pick up line (I'm assuming you are drunk at this point because hot chicks do not play poker and you are really mistaking a 2 for a 10).

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They are not as common at the table as surly, middle-aged Armenians, but some hot chicks do in fact play poker.


Speaking of which, there was a surly, middle-aged Armenian sitting to my left yesterday who wanted to see one particular player's hand almost every time he mucked at showdown. This particular player is super LAG and tends to bluff way too often. So, the only reason he kept asking to see the guy's hands was to get a better idea of what he was bluffing with. There was never a question of collusion; it was pure abuse of the IWTSTH rule.

Also, I think the rule should stay despite the rampant abuse. Seeing as how I play mostly NL, when collusion occurs, it can be much more expensive to the target, and thus I'd prefer to keep every check and balance we can get to keep games on the level.

[AKQJ10]

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Thanks for the link. I'm apparently too dumb to find anything out on my own.

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Naah, not at all. I hope I didn't come off as trying to demean you, but I can see where it might have sounded that way. I'm just trying to have a bit of fun with a repetitive question.

But this is why I want to have a place to put static information like all the 150 different arguments for/against IWTSTH. It's entirely possible that someone might make a stellar point about IWTSTH (or tipping, or what games are spread at the Borgata,....) that none of us had considered before, but if they did it would get lost in all the repetition. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]