|
|
#21
09-11-2006, 07:57 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Re: do i beat ANYTHING here?
he is putting hero on air about 1% of the time. he called the flop because he thought hero likely has set/AA (he didnt fold the flop because he has a pair that is above the board and no one folds those). when the turn comes, there's about a 0% chance that hero has air+firing another bluff. there is prolly a 100% chance that hero checks behind AA (unless he sucks). sets are calling his openpush obviously (even empiremaker said he calls and he loves to fold). if somehow all the money doesnt get in on the turn, a ton of scare cards can come on the river that will prevent KK from stacking QQ/JJ. in a pot this big, someone with AA can easily talk themselves into you having AhKh or somethin like that and making the call. whereas, if you check and they check behind, they're rarely calling a push unless they river the straight.
the most questionable part of the hand, if you have KK, is the flop. the turn lead-push seems good (especially if you're usin this line with AhKh semibluff hands as well). 
|
|
#22
09-11-2006, 08:01 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: do i beat ANYTHING here?
this is my point, if he is calling the flop because he puts hero on set/AA then villain sucks. I think this is a flop fold and calling the flop with KK then open shoving turn means that we have now changed our read from weakness to that of strength, without obtaining any new information. Am I way off here?
|
|
#23
09-11-2006, 08:02 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: do i beat ANYTHING here?
Yuck...the analysis in this thread is bad. First off, of course you call. There is only really 1 hand that beats you, KK. AhTh probably pushes flop. As for hands you beat, well that range could be pretty big...JJ, 44 (very unlikely but possible who knows), KhQh (dunno if he plays it like this) AhKh trying to push you off AA, KQ pushing for value vs AA and not wanting to give you a free shot at 10 outs if you get scared and check behind. etc etc.
Now for everyone saying why would villain play KK like this, why wouldnt he? Its pretty much the only way to play it, other than folding the flop. And then when the turn comes, why would you check when betting will probably get called more, and you avoid scare cards coming (for him, or for you) CDC: This is an extremely easy 4bet vs Schnies squeezing range here. -Mike
|
|
#27
09-11-2006, 08:29 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: do i beat ANYTHING here?
[ QUOTE ]
this is my point, if he is calling the flop because he puts hero on set/AA then villain sucks. I think this is a flop fold and calling the flop with KK then open shoving turn means that we have now changed our read from weakness to that of strength, without obtaining any new information. Am I way off here? [/ QUOTE ] i'm not saying calling the flop is correct. clearly the only options are calling or folding (unless you want to be crazy and try to bluff hero off AA). however, your logic that villain has to decide on the flop if he's up against a set/AA or air and play consistently on the flop+turn is really wrong. The point is that he's unsure on the flop so he check/calls. Once he makes it to that turn card, open-pushing is the best play (imo). It maximizes value against hero's range of hands, period. Who cares if "his flop and turn play are inconsistent, he cant change his read, blah blah blah" that's dumb thinkin.
|
|
#29
09-11-2006, 10:47 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: do i beat ANYTHING here?
[ QUOTE ]
CDC: This is an extremely easy 4bet vs Schnies squeezing range here. [/ QUOTE ] since nobody else was talking about preflop i just assumed it was one of those player dependant things. but against most this is a bad play pf.
|
 |
|
|
Linear Mode
