WTF??? A stuper hand...

[stevepa]

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I'm disappointed that you did not call so I could find out what he has.

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me too [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[grafyx]

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Wouldn't he make a pot sized bet, or something similar, with a made hand to get whatever value he could.

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If Hero is calling a PSB, he may call a push, which would be higher EV for Villian. Especially when weird pushes look like bluffs.

Read the new Slansky NLHE book, has pretty interesting things to say about value bets.



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He says in the book that this is different in tournaments than cash games because the additional chips gained have less value. (Concept 51).

[Exitonly]

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I'd fold, because I used to be a big man and call snapping off a bluff but then they are never bluffing. I used to be a major river calling station, maybe I'm not anymore. Man I'm stoned.

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nah, they definitely bluff here. maybe not often enough, or maybe i've just been on the good side of variance in these spots.

[Melchiades]

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this is always JT. failed cr on turnn. fk it push on river.

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[shaniac]

As others have said, this could be the nuts, some weird busted draw, or even an underpair (def. seen players get goofy here with the gamut), so sometimes I'm wincing and making a great-or-retarded call. Of course folding can't be too wrong esp since you slightly messed up the preflop betting (making it 200-250 preflop might have actually made a big difference in this little hand).

[registrar]

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No reads, he's been here 1 hand. WTF does this??? If you'd call, what's the worst hand you're calling with? If you'd fold, what's the best hand you're folding? Oh, and who bets the turn?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (9 handed) internettexasholdem.com

SB (t2215)
BB (t1480)
UTG (t3370)
UTG+1 (t1830)
MP1 (t1160)
MP2 (t3315)
MP3 (t3870)
CO (t1890)
Hero (t2240)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls t50, <font color="#666666">5 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t150</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, UTG calls t100.

Flop: (t375) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t250</font>, UTG calls t250.

Turn: (t875) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, Hero checks.

River: (t875) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets t2970 (All-In)</font>, Hero???

Final Pot: t3845

edited to add I usually raise to 200 here pf, didn't see the limper...

Steve

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I tend to agree that this is most often, in my experience, a very strong made hand that was expecting to check-raise the turn.

I agree that the pre-flop raise should be bigger and I do bet the turn, pretty hard, and then close down.

If I'm not calling with TPTK on this board then I'm probably not calling with anything plausible on the river. If I had flopped a set, then the whole dynamic of the hand would be different. Two pair doesn't seem any better than one pair in this situation.

[registrar]

And let's say we credit Steve for top pair or top two pair on the flop. The turn gives us the nuts.
1. What's the best way to extract value from here?
2. Assuming you do check the turn, hoping to check-raise, and StevePa Villain checks behind, is it +EV to push the river?

[Beachman42]

I don't think an AI overbet is max EV. I try to bet the most I think my villian will call. sometimes 0.5 of the pot, sometimes 0.5 of his stack.

[Beachman42]

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I'm disappointed that you did not call so I could find out what he has.

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me too [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

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Sometimes NOT knowing makes for a better post [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[SilverLining1]

1. Betting the turn is a tough decision here. You're giong to get value out of a missed flush draw with one card left. But, you build the pot against all made hands and put yourself in a [censored] situation. Checking the turn is fine here, especially with position.

2. His hand range includes a poorly played 44, KQ, a poorly played (at least on the river) J10o/Js10s, a missed flush draw. So, unless I have a set, I'm laying this down on the river. It's an easy lay down, and from the looks of it, the bigger this guy's stack later on, the better for you if you're still around and can isolate him.