To chop or not to chop?

[AngusThermopyle]

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In fact, I thought that most rooms had a always-ignored "no chopping" rule.



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That is when players outside the blinds, usually after the flop, want to "chop".

[psandman]

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note to all - aparently the Wynn policy is you cannot choose when you chop, once you make the choppng agreement with your neighbor you are bound to it. You can of course agree to chop and then remove the agreement when it gets short handed, but you cannot choose to chop based on a hand by hand basis in this card room. To my knowledge thats the only card room that has this policy, are there others?

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TI has that rule and I suspect that it came from the Mirage as did many TI rules.

What hasn't been clear about these types of rules is what if game conditions change. Say for example I chop with the player on my left, but a little while later he leaves and a new player sits down. I remember that this new guy didn't chop with me at another time and I don't want to chop with him anymore am I required to chop with him since I was previously chopping?

My personal rule is that in a game that is not shorthanded I will chop with players who want to chop and not chop with players who don't want to chop.

[uclaben]

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What hasn't been clear about these types of rules is what if game conditions change. Say for example I chop with the player on my left, but a little while later he leaves and a new player sits down. I remember that this new guy didn't chop with me at another time and I don't want to chop with him anymore am I required to chop with him since I was previously chopping?

My personal rule is that in a game that is not shorthanded I will chop with players who want to chop and not chop with players who don't want to chop.

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I think it's on a player-to-player basis. Idea is that you essentially have an agreement with the player to your left and the player to your right: chop or no chop? In fact, I've been in a situation where a player on one side of me wanted to chop, and the other didn't. Wasn't a problem at all.

[psandman]

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Your proposal to only chop when both players have rags makes no sense, since any player asking for a chop would be revealing that they had rags. Now there opponent knows to bet.

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I don't necessarially agree with this. Player/read dependent, I might offer a chop to try to induce a raise and 3-bet with premium hands (in a world where the "optional chop" was not frowned upon).

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Sure you might do that. but if thats the case and the player accepts the chop you aren't keeping with what you call the proper way to play "to push every small edge, and chop to avoid rake when both players hold rag type hands." or do you propose to offer a chop and then renege when it is accepted?

[brettbrettr]

Though laudable, the Wynn should not have a policy on what is clearly a player's choice.

[chillrob]

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Your proposal to only chop when both players have rags makes no sense, since any player asking for a chop would be revealing that they had rags. Now there opponent knows to bet.

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I don't necessarially agree with this. Player/read dependent, I might offer a chop to try to induce a raise and 3-bet with premium hands (in a world where the "optional chop" was not frowned upon).

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Sure you might do that. but if thats the case and the player accepts the chop you aren't keeping with what you call the proper way to play "to push every small edge, and chop to avoid rake when both players hold rag type hands." or do you propose to offer a chop and then renege when it is accepted?

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I assume he meant he would do this if the player refused to chop. I have been the small blind and asked "care to chop", and when told no said "ok then, I raise!". If I offer to chop it doesn't mean I have a bad hand - in that case I had Ace high which I figured was pretty good headsup.

Rob

[goofball]

I play at wynn a lot (albeit less in the last couple of weeks) and I've never heard of such a chopping policy.

[Bankrupt Twice]

OP what you did was very poor etiquette. If you continue to do this you will always get dirty looks and people will talk about you behind your back and in front of you. Seriously, you either always chop or you never chop. Choose one right now, and stick with that decision for the rest of your life. Not just the rest of the session like a lot of people say.

[DMC0627]

First time I went to b&m, about 2 weeks ago, I didn't even know what chop meant. A woman sat down in the sb to my bb and asked if I wanted to and said she always chopped, only the house benefits from the rake. I said no problem. We chopped twice and she looked at her cards both times.

The third time, the "I always chop to avoid the rake" went right out the window. She looked at her cards and said "raise". I was pretty annoyed because I had chopped 2 hands with her without even looking.

I looked down at my hand to find my first ever pair of pocket aces. I just called. The flop came king high, I checked, she bet. Turn a rag, I checked, she bets I raise, she reraises, I call. The river, nothing to scare me, we go back and forth betting and raising. She turns over kj of clubs, and I take the pot.

She grabs her rack and starts packing up. As she was leaving, she actually said, I didn't know you were gonna act like a jerk. She really said that, honestly. I hadn't said anything to her to upset her at all. It was all I could do not to laugh right in front of her. Good times.

[bav]

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TI has that rule and I suspect that it came from the Mirage as did many TI rules.

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Yep. Mirage was until now the only Vegas room I knew of that had this rule. TI is news to me, but I've never played in TI's room. Wynn is REALLY news to me. But I see violations of "chop once chop always" pretty rarely anyway so it could in fact be a rule many places and I just don't know it.