Home game ruling - was this guy a douche?

[Rottersod]

[ QUOTE ]
Adolf instantly throws his J8 face up in the middle of the table, gestures to the pot and says 'take it'. Bambi says 'oh ok, cool!' and reaches for the pot, in doing so putting his Q10 face up on the table. Adolf goes apeshit, and starts saying 'my pot, my pot!' Brief argument ensues between Adolf and another player, with Bambi looking on bemusedly. Pot ends up being awarded to Adolf after a vote by the other players at the table.

My feeling was that the pot should have been Bambis. Whats the correct ruling?

[/ QUOTE ]

This scenario happens many times in casinos. Guy with a bad pair will bluff and get called and he figures there's no way his hand can be good if the other guy called so he says something like "take it" or "you got it" and then the other guy turns over an even worse hand (he may have called because he though the first guy was on a missed draw and was trying to steal the pot). So long as he tables his hand (turns the cards face up on the table for the dealer to read and not just show his neighbor that he had a hand) his cards speak and he wins the pot. If the other guy mucks instead of tabling it then he can table his hand and still win it although he'd better show down at least some kind of hand and not complete garbage or else he will be accused of angle-shooting.

[EasilyFound]

In my home game, if a player at showdown mucks his hand (meaning that the cards are thrown into the muck face down so nobody sees them), I do not require the other player to show a hand to be awarded the pot. In other words, a player can surrender a pot at showdown.

The rule at showdown is cards speak, regardless of what anyone says. If one player's cards are shown, another player cannot be awarded the pot without showing his or her cards.

I'd be happy to hear what other people do if they follow a different rule.

[Small Fry]

I'm going to delete what was originally here and replace it. After rereading the Op I realized this was a tourney in which case an all in player cannot fold. His hand must be tabled.

My mistake. Sorry for creating some confusion

[Lottery Larry]

[ QUOTE ]
I want to make sure I get this correct because I'm surprised. (if "let's go" = "call" (B&M forum) then surely "take it" can = "fold". Or maybe not?)

1. Adolf says "take it" and throws his cards forward into the center of the table. What is the ruling regarding his hand at this point?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read the OP again:
" River is an ace. Bambi checks, Adolf goes all in"

Adolf can no longer "fold" his hand, only be beaten by a better hand. Now, if he threw his cards into the muck as unidentifiable, and not having exposed them.... or maybe if he DID expose them, then maybe you could consider his hand folded if they'd hit the muck... but I'd want a strong written rule around it.

I'd give Adolf a KITN if he did throw them into the muck (you have to worry about the collusion angle here).

The rest is just noise.

[pfapfap]

I think Larry is making a distinction between folding and mucking, further obfuscating the issue.

I chatted with those in the know at the cardroom this morning. I'd like to amend my previous statement and say that "I fold" while tabling a hand does not concede the pot, no more than saying "I have a straight flush" while tabling 7-high can transform the tabled hand.

I think in the past I've mucked hands that were tabled and pushed towards me with "I fold" or something similar, but it so rarely happens. I'll be on the lookout in the future and not muck a hand if it's tabled, regardless of what's said.

In short, tabling a hand locks it.

[Rottersod]

[ QUOTE ]
In my home game, if a player at showdown mucks his hand (meaning that the cards are thrown into the muck face down so nobody sees them), I do not require the other player to show a hand to be awarded the pot. In other words, a player can surrender a pot at showdown.

The rule at showdown is cards speak, regardless of what anyone says. If one player's cards are shown, another player cannot be awarded the pot without showing his or her cards.

I'd be happy to hear what other people do if they follow a different rule.

[/ QUOTE ]

Excellent rule. This is how things should be.

[jeffnc]

There is no such thing as a "fold" after the river bet has been called.

Adolf wins the pot. Bambi goofed by not simply waiting for the dealer to much Adolf's cards and slide the pot to Bambi. At that point Bambi can quietly much his cards.