2nd nuts 4 flush board - can i pay this off?

[Ansky]

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Obviously this sucks, but I would probably call mainly because checking the turn with the Ace of spades seems non-standard.

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so u call w/ the 8s cause u think hes bluffing? or u call w/ the ks cause he can have worse spades?

[raptor517]

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Obviously this sucks, but I would probably call mainly because checking the turn with the Ace of spades seems non-standard.

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so u call w/ the 8s cause u think hes bluffing? or u call w/ the ks cause he can have worse spades?

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oh good i didnt have to say it. 8s is same as Ks like.. theres maybe 1% chance hes trying to bluff with a worse spade than a K but higher than an 8.. so i mean he either has As or bluff, and ppl just dont bluff here enough to make calling profitable. and really u HAVE to look at it as Ks = 8s. otherwise you are just being stubborn. good fold, dont sweat it, monkeys be monkeys.

[LerkEr]

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Obviously this sucks, but I would probably call mainly because checking the turn with the Ace of spades seems non-standard.

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so u call w/ the 8s cause u think hes bluffing? or u call w/ the ks cause he can have worse spades?

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+1000

[Ship Ship McGipp]

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Obviously this sucks, but I would probably call mainly because checking the turn with the Ace of spades seems non-standard.

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so u call w/ the 8s cause u think hes bluffing? or u call w/ the ks cause he can have worse spades?

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oh good i didnt have to say it. 8s is same as Ks like.. theres maybe 1% chance hes trying to bluff with a worse spade than a K but higher than an 8.. so i mean he either has As or bluff, and ppl just dont bluff here enough to make calling profitable. and really u HAVE to look at it as Ks = 8s. otherwise you are just being stubborn. good fold, dont sweat it, monkeys be monkeys.

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i'm usually not one to harp on not being super exploitable, but i do have something to say.

given that we are almost never flatting Ax off with just the A spades, the fact taht frequently (though not always obviously) Ax of spades will CR the flop, lead the turn, or check the river (as well as most of our flatting range of AXs has one of those lower spades on the board). what i'm saying is we almost never have the nuts. he can definitely have the nuts. a TON of his A x hands that chekc behind the turn have the A spades. AK AQ etc type hands with As only would prob check turn to under rep and PC, so he can def rep that.

our 655 bet on the rive rlooks like exactly what it is, a face card spade, which seems infinitely more likely than the A of spades to me, betting mediumish to smallish for value. i'm not saying we induced, but we sure as heck might have, since our river bet goes in line with our previous line of having the face card spade moreso than the A of spades.

i'm not saying this guy is thinking about all this during the hand, because i almost never given unknowns credit for this line of thought even at 25-50, but it just seems so unlikely that we can have the nuts, and completely plausible for him to represent the nuts.

edit- point of my point was to harp on betting 750 or 800 on the river to polarize our range more (even though we really aren't it looks like we are) and if we do bet this much, to think long and hard about calling.

[BobboFitos]

i would

[raptor517]

lookit u being all intelligent. i like it!

[MasterLJ]

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Obviously this sucks, but I would probably call mainly because checking the turn with the Ace of spades seems non-standard.

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so u call w/ the 8s cause u think hes bluffing? or u call w/ the ks cause he can have worse spades?

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oh good i didnt have to say it. 8s is same as Ks like.. theres maybe 1% chance hes trying to bluff with a worse spade than a K but higher than an 8.. so i mean he either has As or bluff, and ppl just dont bluff here enough to make calling profitable. and really u HAVE to look at it as Ks = 8s. otherwise you are just being stubborn. good fold, dont sweat it, monkeys be monkeys.

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Just to play devil's advocate, doesn't this mean that you could very very profitably bluff almost every single 4 flush board?

[MadeHand]

Interesting hand, your check call, check then weak bet river smacks of weakness and invites the bluff on the 4 flush board. In fact, thinking about it I would bet that amount if I had As and wanted to induce the bluff if I thought villian was clever enough.

K high flush v A high flush on 4 flush board. Problem is, if you fold too easily it just presents an almighty bluffing opportunity for your opponents- there's basically just one card in the deck that they are afraid of. It's something I don't have an answer to.

I'm playing this hand more aggressively. Pre flop I would raise- Ako is very strong 5 handed although it does depend how tight your table is, where I play it is v aggro. You're only 100BB deep.