live 3/6 how much of a hand do i have here?

[StellarWind]

I don't like the tone of several posts in this thread. Please lay off the personal attacks.

RudeboyOi this is what you told us about Villain:

[ QUOTE ]
LP nitty player raises

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A9+ KT+ QJ+ 88+ is likely her range here
perhaps a bit tighter AT+ KJ+ 99+

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Then you concluded:

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look youre missing out on monies vs this villian
if youre gonna release your hand often postflop
when your range leans towards two big cards
im gonna defend in the bb with almost anything
with the intention of c/r flop and b/f the turn
on ragged uncoordinated boards such as Q73
if i see 2 broadway cards flop im outta there

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It just doesn't work that way. Naturally there are opponents that you can do this against but the Villain you described does not begin to qualify. You will lose a fortune if you insist on constantly attacking ordinary tight/passive players from OOP with any two cards.

Specifics:

1. Defending 94s versus such a tight raiser is reckless in almost any game. Given the typical large rake at live 3/6 it's a major leak.

2. You have very close to the most useless possible hand for this flop. You shouldn't be checkraising with any two cards in this situation.

3. Why are you even asking whether you can call after you get 3-bet? You have no hand and no draw OOP versus a reliable opponent who says she has a very good hand.

If you want to play a hyperaggressive style then you absolutely have to know when to stop. This is about as clear a stop sign as you are ever going to get.

[Scary_Tiger]

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im not too concerned about metagame consequences

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live 3/6

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This post is terrible, the hand is a fold all three times.

[RudeboyOi]

well okay the general consensus here is to fold

but what if we change the case slightly

saying we also flopped 3 to a flush

does it just barely sway our decision to a call?

we can see a river if we turn a 2, 6, or diamond

im not sure how likely this is but i could see
this villian possibly checking thru an A turn
fearful that it may have helped us which would
then give us a freeshot at hitting our gutshot

id donk a river if we made a straight and c/r a flush

this is at one of those new automated tables
so the rake here is the same online $3-max
and there is no dealer there to tip either

[TheHip41]

[ QUOTE ]
well okay the general consensus here is to fold

but what if we change the case slightly

saying we also flopped 3 to a flush

does it just barely sway our decision to a call?

we can see a river if we turn a 2, 6, or diamond

im not sure how likely this is but i could see
this villian possibly checking thru an A turn
fearful that it may have helped us which would
then give us a freeshot at hitting our gutshot

id donk a river if we made a straight and c/r a flush

this is at one of those new automated tables
so the rake here is the same online $3-max
and there is no dealer there to tip either

[/ QUOTE ]


give it up already, even if you have a backdoor flush draw, it doesn't matter, he has KK, you lose, next hand.

why are you so concerned with this little bitty pot of 4sb when you have no pair no draw? i just dont understand

[KitCloudkicker]

op you watch too much tv poker. it's 3/6 live, stop tryin to make moves and just value bet when you have a hand.

[RudeboyOi]

okay idk whats with all of the personal attacks

this villian is not showdown bound and prone to folding
her reactions to my bets are 100% honest and easy to read
anyone who wont make a move on this flop is missing out

quit trying to make a general statement that every 3/6 player is never ever folding any hand they choose to play

this is not true

the purpose of this thread is whats the bare mininum hand you can continue with here on this board when she 3bets

the first case is a clear fold but
what if we now add a 3flush

shes telling us she has an overpair here

this is more of a conditional probability question

we have about 16 outs to improve our hand on the turn
9 diamonds, 3 2s, 3 6s, 3 As (~1 out i can see her checking back that turn some portion of the time if an ace hits)

this is also not a player we can extract
more than 3bbs on the turn and river from
so our implied odds go down on the river
wed have to donk a straight or miss value
but can possibly c/r a flush on the river

[NinaWilliams]

[ QUOTE ]
okay idk whats with all of the personal attacks

this villian is not showdown bound and prone to folding
her reactions to my bets are 100% honest and easy to read
anyone who wont make a move on this flop is missing out

quit trying to make a general statement that every 3/6 player is never ever folding any hand they choose to play

this is not true

the purpose of this thread is whats the bare mininum hand you can continue with here on this board when she 3bets

the first case is a clear fold but
what if we now add a 3flush

shes telling us she has an overpair here

this is more of a conditional probability question

we have about 16 outs to improve our hand on the turn
9 diamonds, 3 2s, 3 6s, 3 As (~1 out i can see her checking back that turn some portion of the time if an ace hits)

this is also not a player we can extract
more than 3bbs on the turn and river from
so our implied odds go down on the river
wed have to donk a straight or miss value
but can possibly c/r a flush on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

With a bd flush draw you go from about .5 outs to 1.5 outs. Still not enough to continue. Also I dont know why youre defending your play this hand. 94s had really poor equity vs a tight open. On the flop the pot is 2bb and your going to have to put in at least 2bb to win it. You arent giving up anything by just folding.

[Oink]

[ QUOTE ]
okay idk whats with all of the personal attacks

this villian is not showdown bound and prone to folding
her reactions to my bets are 100% honest and easy to read
anyone who wont make a move on this flop is missing out

quit trying to make a general statement that every 3/6 player is never ever folding any hand they choose to play

this is not true

the purpose of this thread is whats the bare mininum hand you can continue with here on this board when she 3bets

the first case is a clear fold but
what if we now add a 3flush

shes telling us she has an overpair here

this is more of a conditional probability question

we have about 16 outs to improve our hand on the turn
9 diamonds, 3 2s, 3 6s, 3 As (~1 out i can see her checking back that turn some portion of the time if an ace hits)

this is also not a player we can extract
more than 3bbs on the turn and river from
so our implied odds go down on the river
wed have to donk a straight or miss value
but can possibly c/r a flush on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

If you think villain is a huge nit I dont mind you flop play altho I would prolly just 3-bet pre. But as played I dont see how you can continue in the hand after she 3-bets.

[blackasthma]

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[ QUOTE ]
3-bet preflop or fold.

Edited by StellarWind (08/09/07 12:06 AM)

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I don't like the tone of several posts in this thread. Please lay off the personal attacks.

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With all due respect, Mr. Moderator, if you're going to delete my personal attack, then I wish you'd delete my entire post. This entire thread is ridiculous...

[milesdyson]

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her reactions to my bets are 100% honest and easy to read

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i defend with 4d9d in the BB

flop is 358 (i have no 3-flush)
i c/r her
she doublechecks her cards and 3bets

can i even call here?

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