Bonds Haters: Please post why you hate Bonds

[bwana devil]

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1) I never saw Ted Williams play.
2) Adjust for difficulty of league, then get back to me.
3) Hits and batting average lolol

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1) just because you never got to see williams play doesnt mean he wasnt real.

2) adjust for the league's round the clock trainers, physical therapists, nutritionist, sports pyschologists, gyms and travel by plane.

3) 1497 strikeouts and counting lolol.

[James282]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) I never saw Ted Williams play.
2) Adjust for difficulty of league, then get back to me.
3) Hits and batting average lolol

[/ QUOTE ]

1) just because you never got to see williams play doesnt mean he wasnt real.

2) adjust for the league's round the clock trainers, physical therapists, nutritionist, sports pyschologists, gyms and travel by plane.

3) 1497 strikeouts and counting lolol.

[/ QUOTE ]

bwana,

You are in over your head here. A) the pitchers bonds faces also use these same enhancements that Bonds uses. B) "hits per game" is a worthless stat. C) strikeouts is a worthless stat in isolation D) adjusting for the leagues they play in is possibly the most important thing you can do. our population is huge, games are managed differently, players are used differently(starters are pulled earlier in favor of specialist relievers so instead of facing some worn down dude you face some young guy who throws 95 mph, sidearm, lefty lefty, etc)...it's just a different game. Read BBTN for more details on adjusting for all time, it's very important.

James

[kyleb]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) I never saw Ted Williams play.
2) Adjust for difficulty of league, then get back to me.
3) Hits and batting average lolol

[/ QUOTE ]

1) just because you never got to see williams play doesnt mean he wasnt real.

2) adjust for the league's round the clock trainers, physical therapists, nutritionist, sports pyschologists, gyms and travel by plane.

3) 1497 strikeouts and counting lolol.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, you have no idea what you're talking about, so I'll stop wasting my time.

[dontmesswithme]

Kind of hard to get a hit when you're getting IBBed every AB no?

[Pudge714]

bwana,
What James and KyleB said. Also Ted Williams was by all accounts as big a dick as Bonds he just didn't juice.

[kyleb]

And of course let's not forget that most of these players used amphetamines.

[RedBean]

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williams beats bonds in every stat when you take into acct number of games played.


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You chose some curious stats to argue your point. On top of that, you botched some of the math and methodology.

For one, Bonds definately averages more HR per game than Williams. Not sure how you came up with the wrong number.

Secondly, you conveniently left out intentional walks in calculating walks per game. Huge difference when you count them.

Thirdly, your methodology relies heavily on Bonds having been "sub-par" from '86-'89 and thus "dragging down" his career averages. Re-run those number on Bonds age 25+ and it makes a big difference.

Granted, those years happened, and the stats count, but taking his subpar years from age 20-24 is hardly a valid argument as to why Bonds at age 35-39 is not a better hitter than Williams could ever dream of.

Williams appears to be better when the sum of their entire careers are taken into consideration and it is averaged per game.

Bonds is easily better when looking at their peaks, as it dwarfs anything reached by Williams.

In short, Williams may have been a consistently better hitter than Bonds when averaged over the basis of their entire careers, but he couldn't even dream of obtaining the heights that Bonds reached at his peak.

Bond's best was better than Williams best.

Williams worst was better than Bonds worst.

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there's no question who the better hitter was.


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Better at his peak? Bonds. More consistent over his career? Williams.

[bwana devil]

james, kyle, etc,

what would be a fair way to compare williams and bonds then? i think both players are considered phenomenal players and i think the arguments that youre making for against modern day hitters having it harder, older era hitters faced differed adversities.

and for these specific players, comparing the two presents the unique challenge in that there is the steroid issue, injuries, and military service, just to name a few. so where does that leave us comparing these specific players.

[RedBean]

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.20 HR per game


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It's actually .25 HR per game, which is more than Williams.

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.85 walks per game


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If you don't count IBB's.

If you do count them, it's 1.08 per game, which is alot higher than Williams.

Imagine that.... you mistated Bonds HR and walk totals in trying to show who was a better hitter.

Christ, I can make a case for Mark Lemke being the greatest of all time if I'm allowed to fudge the stats in my favor.

[RedBean]

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so where does that leave us comparing these specific players.

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Single season highs and career for both OPS and adjusted EQA would paint a fair picture.

To save you some time, I'll repeat my previous...over the course of their entire careers, Williams was consistently better......but at their respective peaks, Bonds is far and away better.