Man Arrested for Refusing to Show Drivers License

[rjoefish]

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i'm pretty sure that this kind of case has already been brought to the supreme court. A guy got pulled over and cop asked to see his DL. Guy asked what he did wrong, cop said didn't matter, show me the DL. Guy refused.

I'm pretty sure the gov won, but i'm not sure if the gov actually won or if that case applies here.

As for the actual case, refusing to show your receipt leaving the store is pretty petty and childish, and is in no way a stance for larger civil rights. Its just a way of being a dick.

As for the ID thing, thats [censored]. But cops aren't always the brightest people in the world, and it seems more like a mistake by a cop than a overarching destruction of our civil rights.

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sounds totally different. the guy is operating a car,.. i really hope he is required to show a driver's license when asked by a cop.

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This is the Hiibel case I posted early on in this thread. Someone called and said two people were arguing in a car and he thought the guy had struck the girl. The guy gets there and they are sitting on the side of the road (not sure if they are in a parking lot or not, car running or not). He isn't being suspected of doing anything while operating the motor vehicle, does this change your view? Or is the fact that he's sitting in the car enough?

[Duke]

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God damned Rosa Parks. She should have just sat at the back of the bus and not been an attention whore and a pain in the ass. A seat is a seat. What's the difference where it is.

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Do you have any sense of proportionality whatsoever?

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Good call. She was only standing up for a subset of America.

[Howard Treesong]

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People should also realize that wrt civil liberties, we in the States have it pretty good...

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This kind of bland, generalized statement totally deflects the point here. You don't have to 'pick a spot' when it comes to your rights. You can exercise them at any time, and if somebody tries to physically detain you without cause, THEY are in the wrong. The very idea that you have to 'pick your spots' when exercising your rights implies that others (businesses and government, in this case) are constantly trying to trample them, infringe on them or preclude their exercise. How exactly does that constitute 'having it good'?

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What, exactly, is the right that the business is trying to "trample" here? Do you think you have a right of privacy with respect to the goods you just purchased from that very business?

I'm with the business on the examination of the receipt. At the same time, I'm with Righi on his refusal to show the police his ID.

[Howard Treesong]

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God damned Rosa Parks. She should have just sat at the back of the bus and not been an attention whore and a pain in the ass. A seat is a seat. What's the difference where it is.

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Do you have any sense of proportionality whatsoever?

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Good call. She was only standing up for a subset of America.

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Perhaps you didn't understand my point, so let me rephrase it. Rosa Parks >>>>>>>>>>>&gt ; Michael Righi. Rosa Parks stood up for something that actually matters. Michael Righi blew a bunch of air into a trivial situation for no reason other than he's a self-absorbed douche.

[microbet]

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People should also realize that wrt civil liberties, we in the States have it pretty good...

[/ QUOTE ]

This kind of bland, generalized statement totally deflects the point here. You don't have to 'pick a spot' when it comes to your rights. You can exercise them at any time, and if somebody tries to physically detain you without cause, THEY are in the wrong. The very idea that you have to 'pick your spots' when exercising your rights implies that others (businesses and government, in this case) are constantly trying to trample them, infringe on them or preclude their exercise. How exactly does that constitute 'having it good'?

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What, exactly, is the right that the business is trying to "trample" here? Do you think you have a right of privacy with respect to the goods you just purchased from that very business?

I'm with the business on the examination of the receipt. At the same time, I'm with Righi on his refusal to show the police his ID.

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It's the right to not be detained. You gave them the money. They gave you the goods. Now you can't walk out with your stuff without their permission.

It may not be a big deal, but it's not really that confusing.

[Chips Ahoy]

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Once the cop got there and the store guy said 'we think he might have something he didn't pay for in his bag and he won't show us what's in it along with the receipt.' At that point the cop gets suspicious that he is indeed a 'perp'.

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So you are asked to submit to a voluntary search, and if you decline, that alone is incriminating enough to justify an involuntary search?
Hello, catch-22.

[2/325Falcon]

Righi was right, but he's still a douche because this petty [censored] is the most important thing in his life. If his mother was dying of breast cancer or his girlfriend was having a difficult pregnancy or he had a brother with a serious brain injury from an IED in Iraq this stupid crap wouldn't matter.

As far as this guy saving us all from ZOMG POLICE STATE AMERIKKKA we've already got pedo guy out there keepin' it real.

The cop not knowing his job shouldn't be a shock to anyone. There's variance in the quality of employee in every job. The guy who barely passes med school still gets called "doctor." If you're shocked that this might be the guy responding when you call 911 you're a trusting boob.

The worst thing Righi did was keeping a first responder from being able to respond to an actual emergency in the community. Public safety officials are a limited resource.

[rjoefish]

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Once the cop got there and the store guy said 'we think he might have something he didn't pay for in his bag and he won't show us what's in it along with the receipt.' At that point the cop gets suspicious that he is indeed a 'perp'.

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So you are asked to submit to a voluntary search, and if you decline, that alone is incriminating enough to justify an involuntary search?
Hello, catch-22.

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If a security guard thinks I stole something and asks me to empty my pockets and I don't, he calls a cop and the cop searches me, to figure out if I really did steal. This is standard, no?

[rjoefish]

I do like how he's updating his blog with how he didn't want to take donations, but 'reluctantly' he started and he's raised over 3500$ already. But wait! That's not enough! He's already spent 7500$ and 'its more costly to defend your rights than I thought!' Lots of talk about how he's going to have to take a line of credit out on his house! Oh, and he crossed out the section of him not wanting to talk to the media. You gotta call his lawyer now so he can work out the contractz. At least this guy will make bank out of having to suffer the unimaginable insult to his rights, being asked to show a receipt and an ID.

[Duke]

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God damned Rosa Parks. She should have just sat at the back of the bus and not been an attention whore and a pain in the ass. A seat is a seat. What's the difference where it is.

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Do you have any sense of proportionality whatsoever?

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Good call. She was only standing up for a subset of America.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps you didn't understand my point, so let me rephrase it. Rosa Parks >>>>>>>>>>>&gt ; Michael Righi. Rosa Parks stood up for something that actually matters. Michael Righi blew a bunch of air into a trivial situation for no reason other than he's a self-absorbed douche.

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I'll agree with your assessment of them as human beings. I will not agree with you that this is trivial, and I will not agree that equal rights are more important than those same rights being preserved for everyone.

Screw the bag thing for a second, and let's focus on the important thing. He was arrested for not showing a cop his ID. If it ever becomes mandatory to produce your ID on demand by an authority figure, then Rosa Parks kept her seat for nothing. At that point we're all at the back of the bus. She wanted equal rights because those rights meant something.