Should the Pats be running up the score on everybody in garbage time?

[Semtex]

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Semtex,
My point is that Bill Simmons is one of the people who started writing about the Pats running about the score. Not some beat writer in Indianapolis or Buffalo, Simmons is one the main reasons this is a story.

Why are they listing the Jets as an example of running up the score? Isn't the whole reason they are running up the score a giant FU to people who called them cheaters?

Why is Buffalo listed? There were 10 minutes left to play they weren't going to kneel out for 10 minutes.

It's nice to think that the Pats are so awesome and vengeful that they intentionally score with one minute left in every game to rub it in the face of everyone else, but that isn't the case at all.This argument is much, much better than the lame rationalizations like "Well after the AFC championship game they can never be to careful" or "Peyton did it to so it's okay" or "They still need to fine tune the offense"


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yeah i don't know why people are listing those games or those touchdowns either. the 'running up the score' that i have been seeing is mostly in the final minutes, and involves trying to score touchdowns where other people would settle for the field goal or less. you wouldn't go for it on 4th and more than 5 inside the redzone in a close game so going for it when you are up by 30 seems insulting.

i was trying to quantify this more by finding other examples of teams this season going for it on 4th with less than 5 minutes left deep in the opponents territory. the conclusion is no one really gets into this position because their play calling is so conservative at that point. patriots are the only ones still trying to move the offense in the 4th quarter with huge leads with a variety of passes. i don't know what this says, but i still think its dumb. whether they are trying to run up the score, work on their timing or whatever, no reason to risk injury.

[kyro]

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I think I'd agree to that. At least, I'll say that I think there've been more extreme examples then NE v. DAL.



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I'm not sure about that. Good luck finding a more extreme example than giving the ball to your 18th string RB (who is only on the team because he's an alum of the school the head coach's father is an alum of) 3 straight times.

[Kneel B4 Zod]

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i was trying to quantify this more by finding other examples of teams this season going for it on 4th with less than 5 minutes left deep in the opponents territory.

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go find my post, looks at the raiders game 2 weeks ago

[NT!]

lol so first it's about how classy manning is and never running up the score. then when he DOES throw deep he's just doing it because he thinks the other team should just quit instead of being embarrassed. but when the pats do the same thing it's low. lol.

[Jack of Arcades]

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I think I'd agree to that. At least, I'll say that I think there've been more extreme examples then NE v. DAL.



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I'm not sure about that. Good luck finding a more extreme example than giving the ball to your 18th string RB (who is only on the team because he's an alum of the school the head coach's father is an alum of) 3 straight times.

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Oh, come on. Thanks to injuries, Kyle Eckel is at least tenth on the depth chart.

[vhawk01]

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Semtex,
My point is that Bill Simmons is one of the people who started writing about the Pats running about the score. Not some beat writer in Indianapolis or Buffalo, Simmons is one the main reasons this is a story.

Why are they listing the Jets as an example of running up the score? Isn't the whole reason they are running up the score a giant FU to people who called them cheaters?

Why is Buffalo listed? There were 10 minutes left to play they weren't going to kneel out for 10 minutes.

It's nice to think that the Pats are so awesome and vengeful that they intentionally score with one minute left in every game to rub it in the face of everyone else, but that isn't the case at all.This argument is much, much better than the lame rationalizations like "Well after the AFC championship game they can never be to careful" or "Peyton did it to so it's okay" or "They still need to fine tune the offense"


[/ QUOTE ]
yeah i don't know why people are listing those games or those touchdowns either. the 'running up the score' that i have been seeing is mostly in the final minutes, and involves trying to score touchdowns where other people would settle for the field goal or less. you wouldn't go for it on 4th and more than 5 inside the redzone in a close game so going for it when you are up by 30 seems insulting.



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I wouldn't run the ball up the middle three times and punt in a close game either, I'd open up the passing game. So is that ALSO wrong to do in the final minutes of a blowout? What specific alterations to my game am I supposed to make in order to show class and respect to the other team? I almost said that last sentence with a straight face, but not quite. If I have to make ANY adjustments to my game simply because I am up by a lot of points and the game is late, I am BY DEFINITION no longer showing my opponent any respect.

If I am a team that is getting blown out, and for some reason I am worried about respect, there are only two things I'd like the other team to do. 1, do whatever they feel necessary to avoid injury (and this is by far the most important). 2, play me as hard as you can and don't pull any punches. I'd like to think I've earned that much respect. But ultimately those are just the things I would LIKE my opponent to do. I don't demand or expect them to do anything, and I wouldn't think less of them no matter what they did. If I felt offended by what they were doing, I'm free to try and stop them. If I cant do that, thats my problem.

[Golden_Rhino]

Scoring as many points as possible by running 'regular' plays is cool, and hey, that's sports.

I only consider it running up the score if a team is up big and they start busting out the fake punts and other trick plays.

[Semtex]

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Semtex,
My point is that Bill Simmons is one of the people who started writing about the Pats running about the score. Not some beat writer in Indianapolis or Buffalo, Simmons is one the main reasons this is a story.

Why are they listing the Jets as an example of running up the score? Isn't the whole reason they are running up the score a giant FU to people who called them cheaters?

Why is Buffalo listed? There were 10 minutes left to play they weren't going to kneel out for 10 minutes.

It's nice to think that the Pats are so awesome and vengeful that they intentionally score with one minute left in every game to rub it in the face of everyone else, but that isn't the case at all.This argument is much, much better than the lame rationalizations like "Well after the AFC championship game they can never be to careful" or "Peyton did it to so it's okay" or "They still need to fine tune the offense"


[/ QUOTE ]
yeah i don't know why people are listing those games or those touchdowns either. the 'running up the score' that i have been seeing is mostly in the final minutes, and involves trying to score touchdowns where other people would settle for the field goal or less. you wouldn't go for it on 4th and more than 5 inside the redzone in a close game so going for it when you are up by 30 seems insulting.



[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't run the ball up the middle three times and punt in a close game either, I'd open up the passing game. So is that ALSO wrong to do in the final minutes of a blowout? What specific alterations to my game am I supposed to make in order to show class and respect to the other team? I almost said that last sentence with a straight face, but not quite. If I have to make ANY adjustments to my game simply because I am up by a lot of points and the game is late, I am BY DEFINITION no longer showing my opponent any respect.

If I am a team that is getting blown out, and for some reason I am worried about respect, there are only two things I'd like the other team to do. 1, do whatever they feel necessary to avoid injury (and this is by far the most important). 2, play me as hard as you can and don't pull any punches. I'd like to think I've earned that much respect. But ultimately those are just the things I would LIKE my opponent to do. I don't demand or expect them to do anything, and I wouldn't think less of them no matter what they did. If I felt offended by what they were doing, I'm free to try and stop them. If I cant do that, thats my problem.

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Yeah I probably shouldn't have said that because honestly I don't care about the insulting aspect. Its about strategy mostly. We're talking NFL players here, not the knights of the round table. It doesn't matter what really is offensive or not it matters whether the other team takes offense, and I don't think it takes much to piss off an NFL defender who's team is getting the piss kicked out of it.

[jstnrgrs]

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you wouldn't go for it on 4th and more than 5 inside the redzone in a close game so going for it when you are up by 30 seems insulting.


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I actually think that going for it on 4th down in thses situations is calling off the dogs. It would be easy to take the guaranteed 3 points, and as you point out, if the game were close, that's what they would do. When you go for it, you give the other team a chance to stop you for 0 points (and this has happened to the Pats this year). In the end, the pats probably score fewer points by going for it than by kicking a field goal, so this is the oppostie of running up the score.

The only other option would be to take a knee, but nobody would do that.

[Zutroy]

Isn't it just good strategy to go for it on 4th in that situation though? You're already in the redzone so punting isn't an option. Kicking the field goal nets you three points, which insignificantly increases your lead and gives the other team a chance to return the kickoff for a TD. Kneeling down pins the opponent deep in their own territory and forces them to drive the length of the field at least once. And if you're going to kneel, you might as well go try to score. The TD insulates you from a fluke return or other miracle play. So basically there isn't any real downside to going for it in that situation.

As far as not pulling Brady and other stars, I agree. It's not really worth risk but Brady is rarely sacked and rarely injured altogether.

Basically what the guy above me said in far fewer words