Why "x% of people have y% of the wealth" is irrelevant. - Page 22

neverforgetlol · #**211** 04-01-2007, 04:04 PM

The more wealth is concentrated the more power the few have over the many. What the hell do you think the state is? The capitalists are no different. I don't care if the poor are able to buy more crap they don't need, the class warfare that is caused by unbalanced wealth is a major problem.

How many of you think proles are really any happier with their lives? When they try to measure how happy people are, northern Europe comes out on top.

The more wealth a capitalist gets, the more power they have. THAT is the problem. And the more power, the more coercive things can be. The entire boss-worker relation is coercive by nature. Having a boss making 2x as much as the average worker certainly is not as bad as 300x.

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The reason he was worth $1 billion is because he provided consumers with what they wanted, a high quality inexpensive automobile.

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Actually, it was the workers in the factories provided the cars, (by "mixing their labor" with them).

Ford merely profited by transferring some of the value of their labor to himself.

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Because without Henry Ford, they would have figured out how to make their labor worth that much on their own.

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And? How does Henry Ford know the value of his cars when he isn't even on the assembly line? He's disconnected from his product.

ShakeZula06 · #**212** 04-01-2007, 04:14 PM

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When they try to measure how happy people are, northern Europe comes out on top.

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Yeah, but they also have the hottest women.

LinusKS · #**213** 04-01-2007, 04:45 PM

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Because without Henry Ford, they would have figured out how to make their labor worth that much on their own.

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... so you're saying theft is justified if it leads to the greatest good for the greatest number? (assuming they couldn't figure out how to build a factory on their own).

ShakeZula06 · #**214** 04-01-2007, 04:47 PM

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Because without Henry Ford, they would have figured out how to make their labor worth that much on their own.

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... so you're saying theft is justified if it leads to the greatest good for the greatest number? (assuming they couldn't figure out how to build a factory on their own).

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Theft is a funny word for voluntary transactions...

AlexM · #**215** 04-01-2007, 05:07 PM

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How many of you think proles are really any happier with their lives? When they try to measure how happy people are, northern Europe comes out on top.

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Cause there's an untainted sample right there. Their governments setting the costs of things like drugs so low that pharmaceuticals can only pay for research by raising the costs on Americans. Stuff like that couldn't possibly have any relevance, could it? :P

neverforgetlol · #**216** 04-01-2007, 05:35 PM

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How many of you think proles are really any happier with their lives? When they try to measure how happy people are, northern Europe comes out on top.

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Cause there's an untainted sample right there. Their governments setting the costs of things like drugs so low that pharmaceuticals can only pay for research by raising the costs on Americans. Stuff like that couldn't possibly have any relevance, could it? :P

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You're saying other countries are free riding off America, that's your explanation for being more happy? Boy.

NT! · #**217** 04-01-2007, 05:49 PM

Hi Boro,

I skimmed the thread so forgive me if this has been mentioned.

You state that the 'overall pie' is getting bigger. Or that all standards of living are rising, etc. This was more or less true when Kennedy made the same argument in the 60's, but it's not true today. Real wages for most working and middle class Americans have been either stable or in decline for quite a while now.

LinusKS · #**218** 04-01-2007, 05:59 PM

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Theft is a funny word for voluntary transactions...

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Putting aside for the moment your expansive and self-serving view of the world "voluntary"... isn't it the owner's control over the means of production that makes the "voluntary" transfer of wealth from the worker to the owner possible in the first place?

AlexM · #**219** 04-01-2007, 06:01 PM

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Hi Boro,

I skimmed the thread so forgive me if this has been mentioned.

You state that the 'overall pie' is getting bigger. Or that all standards of living are rising, etc. This was more or less true when Kennedy made the same argument in the 60's, but it's not true today. Real wages for most working and middle class Americans have been either stable or in decline for quite a while now.

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Stable wages doesn't mean the pie's not getting bigger. I dunno about you, but I have a home computer with and Internet connection among many other things that didn't exist then.

AlexM · #**220** 04-01-2007, 06:03 PM

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Theft is a funny word for voluntary transactions...

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Putting aside for the moment your expansive and self-serving view of the world "voluntary"... isn't it the owner's control over the means of production that makes the "voluntary" transfer of wealth from the worker to the owner possible in the first place?

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I can't speak for Shake, but I don't have any desire to own any means of production, so how can my views be "self-serving" in this regard? In fact, since I'm not really even willing to work much in general, I might well be better off in a more socialist environment. (well, before I learned poker, but my basic polical views haven't changed since then anyway)