hmmmmm turn

[Elrazor]

i lead out on the flop with a passion here, ditto turn. as played my imediate thought was CRAI but as CF pointed out, you are maybe getting AQ to fold, maybe....and everything else this type of player calls.

stoved you have 25% against AA, 30 v KJ and 35% v QQ if you shove now - i think calling seems marginally better than shoving, but i cant really fault a shove

[Hattifnatt]

I like preflop and prefer just c/f turn even though I dont hate a c/r, dont think there's much (if any) FE here if behind. deeper and a read on the opponent is aggressive c/r all-in on the turn woulda been fine for sure.

[crashwhips]

Hand is fine, shove over his bet on the turn.

[wazz]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd be surprised if we had any FE here against any sort of decent hand that beats us and I don't see many worse hands calling. That being the case, a c/r is only going to get someone with air to fold. I probably just chill in c/c mode for this turn and reeval on the riv.

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If he has blockers, which is most of what he is bluffing us with, he's certainly betting any blank river. What you're saying is that you want to hit, and check-fold otherwise. This is pretty bad given we have a made hand with a good draw and outs to split/win if we're up against AQ or a set.

As it happens we almost have odds to call against his range and we certainly have some amount of implied odds on the river. If there's enough doubt over whether he has the straight, and there certainly is, we wouldn't want to call then give him lots of value for his bluff by check-folding the river, not to mention the fact that he's unlikely to be playing AQ this way. He might bet a set for value on the river if he's not the type to worry that someone check-calling two streets has the straight, but it would probably have to be QQQ+.

We generally don't have fold equity by c/c flop c/r turn against a lagtard maniac when he has these hands, but the point is merely that we're ahead enough here/have a good enough draw + made hand when behind (any broadway could win). I don't hugely mind check-calling turn but only if you're willing to check-call any river.

[Troll_Inc]

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[ QUOTE ]
I'd be surprised if we had any FE here against any sort of decent hand that beats us and I don't see many worse hands calling. That being the case, a c/r is only going to get someone with air to fold. I probably just chill in c/c mode for this turn and reeval on the riv.

[/ QUOTE ]

If he has blockers, which is most of what he is bluffing us with, he's certainly betting any blank river. What you're saying is that you want to hit, and check-fold otherwise. This is pretty bad given we have a made hand with a good draw and outs to split/win if we're up against AQ or a set. As it happens we almost have odds to call and we certainly have some amount of implied odds on the river. If there's enough doubt over whether he has the straight, and there certainly is, we wouldn't want to call then give him lots of value for his bluff, not to mention the fact that he's unlikely to be playing AQ this way. He might bet a set for value on the river if he's not the type to worry that someone check-calling two streets has the straight, but it would probably have to be QQQ+. We generally don't have fold equity by c/c flop c/r turn against a lagtard maniac when he has these hands, but the point is merely that we're ahead enough here/have a good enough draw + made hand when behind (a Q would win, for example, if villain is playing something like AJTx with a lower flush draw). I don't hugely mind check-calling turn but only if you're willing to check-call any river.

[/ QUOTE ]

You should lay off the weed man.....it's going to turn your brain to mush.

[wazz]

K I've been playing live and smoking for about 8 hours tonight, I'll come back to it tomorrow and see whether I've basically just given retarded advice. Pretty sure I felt this way beforehand though, maybe I've just said it wrong.

[Troll_Inc]

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K I've been playing live and smoking for about 8 hours tonight, I'll come back to it tomorrow and see whether I've basically just given retarded advice. Pretty sure I felt this way beforehand though, maybe I've just said it wrong.

[/ QUOTE ]

It might be good advice, just that it is hard to read with no spaces. (Also it's about 10x the amount you usually write [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img])

[jbird]

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That being the case, a c/r is only going to get someone with air to fold. I probably just chill in c/c mode for this turn and reeval on the riv.

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I don't hugely mind check-calling turn but only if you're willing to check-call any river.


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Given the way I played the hand, I was thinking c/c here and c/c river would probably be better than pushing this turn.

The one big problem with that line as I see it is if I make my flush even this hero may not fire again.