Any starter tips for a pot limit omaha?

[MediaPA]

Most low limit PLO games I've played are filled with limpers. 6 or so people see a flop. So many hands become playable.

About the only hand that I semi-routinely bluff is the a flush if I have the ace for that suit. It's more that I know what they don't have.

There are also other times where you just 'know' that no one else is interested in the pot and a bet will take it down which is why position helps.

You need to be able to read the board and figure out some likely danger cards. One thing that people tend to do a little too much is go wild with made hands (straights for example). This is fine for holdem. However, there will can often be a redraw (higher straight, flush, full house) for the other player. It's just one thing to get used to in the game - the nuts on the flop often different by the river (and people will have it)

[Styhn]

That was a interesting Post Janelle, I'm trying to pick up pot limit Omaha myself and I found your info be very useful. Thanks!

[JanelleBB7]

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You want to avoid playing hands like A6T9 single suited.

[/ QUOTE ] Disagree - once you play a lot of PLO and become really good post-flop then A6T9 wherever suited is a good hand to play without a raise

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#4. Two pair is always over played by Holdem players who come to PLO. Don't be the lead better in a pot with just two pair because two pair rarely wins in this game. There is more to this but just keep it in mind.


[/ QUOTE ] If can you differentiate the danger level of the board and can read your opponents well, then strongly consider leading with two pair.

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My advice is for a beginner -- keep this in mind.

I have played these hands myself but for a noob who is just learning it is best to be very tight until you understand what you can and can't get away with in PLO. A person just coming from Holdem is likely to hang themselves on A6T9 single suited. Also they will fail to recognize when their two pair is good and when they are up against a much better hand. I have seen holdem players bust out on 2 pair so many times.

Your reply is true but keep in mind the audience is total beginner.

[JanelleBB7]

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Most low limit PLO games I've played are filled with limpers. 6 or so people see a flop. So many hands become playable.

About the only hand that I semi-routinely bluff is the a flush if I have the ace for that suit. It's more that I know what they don't have.

There are also other times where you just 'know' that no one else is interested in the pot and a bet will take it down which is why position helps.

You need to be able to read the board and figure out some likely danger cards. One thing that people tend to do a little too much is go wild with made hands (straights for example). This is fine for holdem. However, there will can often be a redraw (higher straight, flush, full house) for the other player. It's just one thing to get used to in the game - the nuts on the flop often different by the river (and people will have it)

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Yes understandin redraws is huge in PLO. Good point... this is a little more advanced a topic then I was going to get into late last night... hmm guess it was in the wee hours of the morning.

Holdem players often think when they have the current nuts that their hand is golden and will go for it. For example if you have AKxx not suited and the board comes out JsThQh and you pot the flop ( which I reccomend you do immediately - DO NOT slow play as a beginner) If the other player Reraises you... you are in trouble unless this guy is a total idiot. No PLOer is going to reraise that flop with anything less than a straight ( it is possible trips and a flush draw but most likely they have a straight) and will almost assuredly have the REDRAW. This means that you are the dog despite having the current nuts. BEWARE of redraws.

KEY thing in PLO is that you have to have the discipline to lay down hands which you would NEVER lay down in holdem. I have a great example of an amazing laydown I did recently. I was playing someone that I play with on a regular basis and when I told him what I laid down he was so amazed that he agreed to show me his hand history, if I showed him my handhistory. This example will also reveal why a BEGINNER has to be VERY selective with their starting hands because a hand like this easily will get you into trouble. See example below:

Full Tilt Poker Game #4070620078: Table Chartered - $0.25/$0.50 - Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 19:58:36 ET - 2007/11/04
Seat 1: Seraphim825 ($35.75)
Seat 2: JanelleBB7 ($59.50)
Seat 3: Toesack ($53.30), is sitting out
Seat 4: gammalight ($48)
Seat 5: Ceppo ($95.20)
Seat 6: pahan_ ($53.90)
Seat 7: Magicman05 ($23.40)
Seat 8: HebeyJuan ($78.70)
Seat 9: TEKKTRIBE ($168.25)
JanelleBB7 posts the small blind of $0.25
gammalight posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #1
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to JanelleBB7 [9c 9h 7d 4c]
Ceppo calls $0.50
pahan_ folds
Magicman05 folds
HebeyJuan folds
TEKKTRIBE folds
Seraphim825 folds
JanelleBB7 calls $0.25
gammalight checks
*** FLOP *** [5d 9s Ts]
JanelleBB7 bets $1.50
gammalight folds
Ceppo raises to $6
JanelleBB7 calls $4.50
*** TURN *** [5d 9s Ts] [7c]
JanelleBB7 checks
Ceppo checks
*** RIVER *** [5d 9s Ts 7c] [7s]
JanelleBB7 bets $6.75
Ceppo raises to $18.50
JanelleBB7 has 15 seconds left to act
JanelleBB7: damn u have tens i had 9s lol
JanelleBB7 folds
Uncalled bet of $11.75 returned to Ceppo
Ceppo mucks
Ceppo wins the pot ($25.65)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $27 | Rake $1.35

THE HAND HISTORY HE EMAILED ME:

FullTiltPoker Game #4070620078: Table Chartered - $0.25/$0.50 - Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 19:58:36 ET - 2007/11/04
Seat 1: Seraphim825 ($35.75)
Seat 2: JanelleBB7 ($59.50)
Seat 3: Toesack ($53.30), is sitting out
Seat 4: gammalight ($48)
Seat 5: Ceppo ($95.20)
Seat 6: pahan_ ($53.90)
Seat 7: Magicman05 ($23.40)
Seat 8: HebeyJuan ($78.70)
Seat 9: TEKKTRIBE ($168.25)
JanelleBB7 posts the small blind of $0.25
gammalight posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #1
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Ceppo [Ad 4h Tc Td]
Ceppo calls $0.50
pahan_ folds
Magicman05 folds
HebeyJuan folds
TEKKTRIBE folds
Seraphim825 folds
JanelleBB7 calls $0.25
gammalight checks
*** FLOP *** [5d 9s Ts]
JanelleBB7 bets $1.50
gammalight folds
Ceppo raises to $6
JanelleBB7 calls $4.50
*** TURN *** [5d 9s Ts] [7c]
JanelleBB7 checks
Ceppo checks
*** RIVER *** [5d 9s Ts 7c] [7s]
JanelleBB7 bets $6.75
Ceppo raises to $18.50
JanelleBB7 has 15 seconds left to act
JanelleBB7: damn u have tens i had 9s lol
JanelleBB7 folds
Uncalled bet of $11.75 returned to Ceppo
Ceppo mucks
Ceppo wins the pot ($25.65)


When you get good at PLO you recognize the strength of your hand against your opponent and have to be capable of really difficult lay downs as this was. I happen to know this player as a regular and I was certain that when he reraised me on the flop he either had a str8 & flush draw or trip tens... to me there were no other hand possibilities. When he checked the turn, I was fairly certain he had trip tens, but I bet out to see if my boat was good. If you get reraised on a paired board in a hand like this when he reraised me like he did on the flop it = better boat = fold. This is why i folded this hand without a doubt that he had a better boat.



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Advice for full ring PLO:

1. Slowplay when you flop quads. People will pay you off huge if you let them.

2. Slowplay against LAGs in the right spot. Thinking LAGs might shutdown to a reraise. Check/call them.

3. Beware of the slowplay. PLO donkballs love to checkraise.

4. Don't draw to a straight if the flop is 2 to a flush.

5. Don't draw to a flush on a paired flop.

6. Don't call a pot bet on the flop without at least 2 strong draws. Or the nuts and a redraw.

7. If you hit the flop hard, pot it. See #6. If reraised, 3 bet all-in. Do this with top set too if it's the current nuts.

8. Play trips and sets carefully.

9. Don't die with unimproved trips.

10. Don't die with middle or bottom set.

11. Don't die with an underboat.

12. Obviously don't die with 2 pair.

13. Be able to lay down nut flushes, boats, nut straights, on a scary river, facing an all-in bet. Thinking players might bluff a scare card, but usually, if you call, you will not be goot.

14. Know how to read a board stone cold. That takes time.

15. Don't play PLO and PLO8 at the same time.

16. Don't play PLO and NL holdem at the same time.

[JanelleBB7]

[ QUOTE ]
Advice for full ring PLO:

1. Slowplay when you flop quads. People will pay you off huge if you let them.

2. Slowplay against LAGs in the right spot. Thinking LAGs might shutdown to a reraise. Check/call them.

3. Beware of the slowplay. PLO donkballs love to checkraise.

4. Don't draw to a straight if the flop is 2 to a flush.

5. Don't draw to a flush on a paired flop.

6. Don't call a pot bet on the flop without at least 2 strong draws. Or the nuts and a redraw.

7. If you hit the flop hard, pot it. See #6. If reraised, 3 bet all-in. Do this with top set too if it's the current nuts.

8. Play trips and sets carefully.

9. Don't die with unimproved trips.

10. Don't die with middle or bottom set.

11. Don't die with an underboat.

12. Obviously don't die with 2 pair.

13. Be able to lay down nut flushes, boats, nut straights, on a scary river, facing an all-in bet. Thinking players might bluff a scare card, but usually, if you call, you will not be goot.

14. Know how to read a board stone cold. That takes time.

15. Don't play PLO and PLO8 at the same time.

16. Don't play PLO and NL holdem at the same time.



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[img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] Good advice.