Clinton backs N.Y. driver's license plan for illegal immigrants

[Luxoris]

[ QUOTE ]
President Bush is to blame for the immigration reform bill not passing. He is a Republican president who couldn't convince a Republican congress that his bill was any good. The Democrats were largely in favor of it.

I'd rather see Hillary president with both hands tied behind her back than the current incompetent. It's hard to imagine her doing a worse job, even if she tries.

[/ QUOTE ]

Start with the assumption that she lives up to her promise of tax increases. Done, she's already done a worse job than the current incompetent.

[pvn]

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I saw on the news where spitzer said no only citizens can vote, this is only d.l.

but, what else do you need beside d.l. and proof of residence (like a lease), where youlive, to vote?

actually last time i voted I think i just needed d.l., although i think it had my current adddress.

[/ QUOTE ]

Last I checked, you had to be registered. You don't just show up with your drivers license and head into the booth. I don't know what the registration process entails as far as checking for eligibility, though.

[PLOlover]

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I don't know what the registration process entails as far as checking for eligibility, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

well yeah, you just fill out a form, guys in front of supermarkets a lot of times, you don't need anything, just an address cause they mail you something i think.

maybe that was the point, you don't need a d.l. to vote so it's moot.

[andyfox]

I'm sorry, but if the president had been able to keep his support among the Republicans in congress, the bill would have passed. I heard perhaps twenty-five prominent Republicans in congress on talk radio saying the bill was the worst thing since leprosy, not one Democrat. The president has shown a lack of leadership on other issues that are supposedly important to him that, because of his ineptitude, died quickly: social security reform and energy independence come to mind.

Hillary's smart and she's been around the block. She would be a capable, competent president.

[andyfox]

What is her plan for tax increases?

[One Outer]

[ QUOTE ]
What is her plan for tax increases?

[/ QUOTE ]

He means that Hillary would allow the Bush tax cuts to expire, which is already part of the law that the Republicans passed and he signed. So she doesn't really have a plan except for not renew the cut.

This was part of the Republicans Machavellian plan to use public policy to push their own agenda. They built a 'sunset clause' into the original legislation so that when the bill's time came they would be able to pass it all over again and try to make themselves look good without actually making any changes at all.

You can't give these [censored] an inch.

[adios]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm sorry, but if the president had been able to keep his support among the Republicans in congress, the bill would have passed.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sorry but if the Democrats had actually tried to build a consensus and promoted the merits of the bill it would have passed.

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I heard perhaps twenty-five prominent Republicans in congress on talk radio saying the bill was the worst thing since leprosy, not one Democrat.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do I really have to show how the Democrats were gushing about how great the bill was and then when the details saw the light of day and the phone lines of Congressman were jammed by their constituents saying the bill was a POS that they started backing away from it? Here's why this is a Democratic party failure mostly. Bush would have certainly signed the bill that went down. The Democrats had the votes in the House and actually at one point had a majority in the Senate if you believe the news reports. What the proponents didn't have and never did have was 60 votes in the Senate to end cloture. In order to get those votes they had to convince a lot of voters than they did that it was a good bill. They couldn't do it. The bill went down because enough people said it was flawed.

Contrast that to a Bush promise to veto such a bill. I give you no better example than SCHP. No if the Democrats (including Hillary) really wanted to pass this bill they needed to do a lot more work to convince voters that it was a worthwhile piece of leglislation.

[ QUOTE ]
The president has shown a lack of leadership on other issues that are supposedly important to him that, because of his ineptitude, died quickly: social security reform and energy independence come to mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not sure what you mean about energy independence but SS is easy. The Democrats never support the issue. I agree with you that if Bush wanted SS reform he needed to build a consensus that included Democratic party support in Congress. However, there a two key differences between immigration reform and SS. The first being that the Democrats wanted to do something about immigration and will willing to take it on in the current session of Congress. Second big difference is that Bush and the Democrats basically agreed on the parameters of what new immigration law should be. No way, no how are the Democrats willing to take on anything to do with changing SS in the current session of Congress. It should be more than obvious that Bush and Democrats have a basic difference about changing SS.

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Hillary's smart and she's been around the block.

[/ QUOTE ]

You could say that about a lot of people.

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She would be a capable, competent president.

[/ QUOTE ]

We'll see if she gets elected but I totally disagree.

Clinton's rivals see an opening

The topic that caused her biggest political headache was the proposal by New York Gov. Eliot Spitzer to give driver's licenses to illegal immigrants.

Asked her stance on it, she first commended Spitzer for attempting to grapple with a problem that persists because of the federal government's failure to enact a "comprehensive" revamping of immigration law.

She later hastened to add she wasn't necessarily endorsing Spitzer's plan.

To that, Sen. Christopher J. Dodd of Connecticut said: "No, no, no. You said yes, you thought it made sense to do it."

"No, I didn't, Chris," Clinton said, prompting Edwards to accuse her of double-talk.

This one time I actually agree with Edwards. This kind of performance leaves a lot to be desired IMO but I concede it doesn't mean much as to how she would perform in office.

[adios]

[ QUOTE ]
What is her plan for tax increases?

[/ QUOTE ]

Earlier in the debate, Clinton was asked about the controversial plan by Rep. Charles B. Rangel (D-N.Y.) to overhaul the tax code. Rangel, a Clinton supporter, has suggested repealing the Alternative Minimum Tax, a burden to some middle-class families, and imposing a 4% surtax on wealthier households.

In the course of her answer, Clinton praised Rangel's "goal," said she did not have all the specifics of the plan and added that she did not like some of the details.

I'm not sure what goal she's praising. Rangel came out and said that his bill was tax simplification. We had that in 1986 with Mr. Reagan and look at the tax code now.

Rangel Tax Plan "Wrangles" Money from Small Businesses and Families to Fatten Federal Wallets

Needless to say some people will have their taxes increased if this ever is enacted. I'd love to see a debate in the 2008 election about taxes.

[adios]

Obama accuses Clinton of hiding behind gender


Apparently Hillary continues to insert foot in mouth following the debate:

Obama, the only black candidate in the U.S. presidential race, told NBC's "Today" show that Clinton is widely viewed as a tough figure in national politics.

"So it doesn't make sense for her, after having run that way for eight months, the first time that people start challenging her point of view, that suddenly she backs off and says: 'Don't pick on me,'" he said.

"That is not, obviously, how we would expect her to operate if she were president," he said.



Apparently Hillary put out a video on YouTube called “The Politics of Pile On" which has a link to it here:

NY Times Political Blog

Nearly three days after the Democratic debate Tuesday night, Senator Hillary Clinton’s post-forum tactics — complete with her video titled “The Politics of Pile On” and her remarks about the all-men’s club of politics — have reverberated with more buzz and backlash than her much-criticized performance in Philadelphia.

The sorry performance in the debate and her reaction to it in the aftermath of the debate is not likely to endear her to voters IMO. She's got a lot of time to recover though.

[andyfox]

Only on people making over $200,000/year.