600: Not Quite According to Plan with 2+2er

[xxrod17xx]

I don't have much to offer at this limit, but I don't understand the value of 3-betting here if you are going to fold to a push. Esp when your 3-bet is semi small which could induce a 4-bet.

[QTip]

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i think if you limp minraise he might repop you and then you can make an EV+ shove since he must fold most of his range

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Now I think I dig that.

[SABR42]

Ok, here is why it's a horrible fold:

Let's put him on a tight range of AA/KK/QQ/AK. I think that's pretty reasonable.

Against that range, AKo has 39% equity!

You already have 25% of your stack in, horrible fold.

[Landlord79]

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for completion:

Like i said, I made it $150 and he pushed.

I tanked and ended up folding.

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I think this is a fine play, you now know exactly where you're at and you can fold and only lose the minimum (besides if you would have l/f'd.) I raise it to at least $180 here though pf. This game is over my limits though, so take my advice w/ a grain of salt.

[QTip]

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Ok, here is why it's a horrible fold:

Let's put him on a tight range of AA/KK/QQ/AK. I think that's pretty reasonable.

Against that range, AKo has 39% equity!

You already have 25% of your stack in, horrible fold.

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SABR:

Good chance I stand to learn something here, so let's discuss this.

I'm failing to see how 25% of my stack has anything to do with this.

I'm going to be calling 450 to win 750. So, I'm getting 1.67:1 on my money. 39% equity is about right there. So, this is about break even given the range you've provided.

[threads13]

I think you should either reraise less(because you think a shove is profitable or because you then give yourself room to fold) or you should reraise more to commit yourself to the hand. If you reraise a bit more you can pretty much shove any flop.

[SABR42]

Well, you need 37.5% to break even.

You're calling $450 to win $750, and the total pot will be $1200.

I believe it's an easy call not only because you are slightly +EV vs that range, but because if you fold, that's terrible for your image. If limp-reraising is part of your game, now you can no longer limp-re-raise on a bluff because people won't respect it, figuring you folded a bluff last time.

[QTip]

1st, you said it was a "horrible fold" I don't think that's the case at all. I think it's extremely close...this is a $10 / 1.35bb "mistake". I see now that different raise sizes are much better for the 100x stacks for situations and hands like this.

2nd - The vast majority of the time I have AA or KK here. So, I'd much prefer people thinking that I do so with trash. Interestingly, this is the 1st time that I've been played back at with a lrr. (go figure) So, I'm praying he took a note that I folded my lrr to a push.

[too eazy]

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Interestingly, this is the 1st time that I've been played back at with a lrr. (go figure) So, I'm praying he took a note that I folded my lrr to a push.

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Well, he posts/lurks here so he probably has a couple extra notes now [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[SABR42]

Ok, I over-estimated your pot-odds at first. That was my mistake. So it's not as bad as I thought at first.

But still, I don't like it because if your plan was to turn AK into a bluff (you said you planned to fold) then AK is way too strong to turn into a bluff, because it becomes a marginally +EV call once you raise and he 4-bets.

If you planned to raise/fold as a bluff I'd prefer you had something weaker that you could fold without regrets.

Once you get yourself into a marginal spot you should call, that's my stance anyway.