Will science ever find the ultimate answer to God?

[madnak]

Who are you calling cartoonish?

[kurto]

I see some similarities...

[drzen]

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I'm not saying that we desperately need an answer.

What I mean is the apparent difficulty or rather impossibility for cosmologists to
a) get infinitely close to the Big Bang

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The limit on this is immaterial in this discussion.

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b) look beyond the observable universe.

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What makes you think there is anywhere to look?

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Do you think these are unshiftable boundaries of what man can find out about the origin of all?
And if yes, what are the consequences?

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Yes, they are. If you cannot observe something in any at all, it can have any value. Consequently, you'll never disprove God.

He is transcendental. He does not exist in space or time. He's unobservable *by definition*. You could only ever hope to prove that he is not observable. So, erm, good luck disproving him.

[housenuts]

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No. I think Science can prove that God is not necessary. But many of the definitions (and let's straight... no one is even sure how to define God. Many definite it differently) are outside of science by definition.


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But we know He looks like us. God created man in His
own image.

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Your cartoon avatar is created in our image too!

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This is an amazing point that must not be simply overlooked.

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in whose image did god create dogs, cats, sharks, etc.? did he just conjure them up in his mind.

[Inso0]

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in whose image did god create dogs, cats, sharks, etc.? did he just conjure them up in his mind?

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You're talking about the creater of the universe, and don't think he can come up with a few original ideas for creature design?

I'd say yes.

Did he come up with the 8,000 different species of spiders? No.

He wrote the genetic code of each kind of animal to allow for diversification down the line.

If you break the billions of species on the planet down to basic "kinds" ... there are probably less than 1000 truly unique animals. I.E. elephants, hippos, porcupines, rats, dogs, horses, etc etc.

[Lestat]

We could not find evidence for any god for the next 10 billion years and theists will always say, it doesn't prove non-existence, it just means god exists outside our observable and detectable realm. So that answer is no.

As to discovering what preceded the big bang and discovering what lies beyond or outside the universe, it just might be beyond our capability, but I suppose it's possible.

FWIW- If I put on my theist hat (and want to believe something I do not know for a fact), I really think it's grander than anyone can imagine. Like an infinite numbers of universes pop into and out of existence all the time. Our entire universe with its galaxies and all might be nothing more significant than a single atom on your pencil.

That's my belief anyway. Prove me wrong! -lol

[madnak]

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If you break the billions of species on the planet down to basic "kinds" ... there are probably less than 1000 truly unique animals. I.E. elephants, hippos, porcupines, rats, dogs, horses, etc etc.

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You realize that there are many more "kinds" of insects than all others combined? And that some "kinds" are restricted to isolated geographical regions with no human activity? And that there are many "kinds" of microorganisms, too? (And so on, and on and on and on...)

[madnak]

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I really think it's grander than anyone can imagine. Like an infinite numbers of universes pop into and out of existence all the time. Our entire universe with its galaxies and all might be nothing more significant than a single atom on your pencil.

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People who talk about how "big" the universe is have no legs to stand on IMO. All we can do is gape. Nobody ever thought of anything resembling quantum physics until we had evidence of it. But QM might be mundane compared to what else is "out there" - and we might never know. Since we might never know, it might be best for us to just assume there's nothing and go on with life. But then we could well be like blind insects unaware of any reality beyond the confines of our tiny little lair.

I think sometimes it's the bullish refusal to consider that possibility, the possibility that humans are only slightly more capable than the other species on earth, and that someone or something out there might be much greater compared to us than we are compared to ants, that causes many people to make so many assumptions. But historically, those assumptions have often proved flat wrong - does that imply something? Can we even figure out whether it implies something?

And then you think about some God who is basically like a human. That's a real let-down. See, most of us want to think we're created in God's image - but that's foolish. We should be afraid of nothing more than that - because if we are images of the ultimate, then the possibility that can be found in our imaginations is just an illusion. I would much rather that our self-importance and religion (even the good ones) are fallacies than that our imaginations are only there to help us jerk off.

[bunny]

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We could not find evidence for any god for the next 10 billion years and theists will always say, it doesn't prove non-existence, it just means god exists outside our observable and detectable realm. So that answer is no.

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From a theist perspective, I think it matters and that it may provide an answer (in the negative). The longer there is no objective evidence, or the more I have to qualify, refine and constrain what i mean by "god" then the more it becomes likely I am mistaken.

[furyshade]

my belief has always been that if we can prove without a doubt that there is randomness in the world, even at a quantum level, then that disproves god. If there is randomness, that means that there is no way that anything can predict what will happen next with exact certainty in the entire universe under any circumstance, therefore god could not have preordained the universe.