NL200 J9s Flops top two on a soaked ass board - Page 2

jlocdog · #11 08-28-2007, 11:55 PM

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Is your turn bet for value? Are you calling a shove right there on turn? How often do you think he calls/shoves less then straight considering flop action?

This bets induces the most bluffs because we leave reasonable stacks to give opponent false hope. It also keeps your range wide going into river since now you have more to bluff with yourself (if you have KQ for example).

pepper123 · #12 08-28-2007, 11:57 PM

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Is your turn bet for value? Are you calling a shove right there on turn? How often do you think he calls/shoves less then straight considering flop action?

This bets induces the most bluffs because we leave reasonable stacks to give opponent false hope. It also keeps your range wide going into river since now you have more to bluff with yourself (if you have KQ for example).

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yes the turn bet is for value. this guy is 50vpip. i don't know why you're trying to rep a bluff let alone balance your range when this dude is calling down with AJ.

jlocdog · #13 08-28-2007, 11:58 PM

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yes because false tells are so useful against donks who play 50% of all hands. turn bet is really bad IMO. id call river after checking, but id still probably value shove it against this guy.

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'Giving off false FE tells' as in giving him a false sense of security with being able to pull off a river bluff.

Fat Nicky · #14 08-29-2007, 12:02 AM

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yes because false tells are so useful against donks who play 50% of all hands. turn bet is really bad IMO. id call river after checking, but id still probably value shove it against this guy.

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'Giving off false FE tells' as in giving him a false sense of security with being able to pull off a river bluff.

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but when he checks the river w/a hand that has showdown value, such as a combo draw (9T) or a weaker 2 pair that is scared of the board..then we miss some serious value because we didn't bet strong on the turn.

also, if we bet $45 on the turn, pot is $150 and he will still have $100 behind. this is plenty for a donk to think he has fold equity if he decides he wants to bluff.

jlocdog · #15 08-29-2007, 12:04 AM

Given flop action, I expect AJ/2pair to raise us on the flop. Infact because he just called makes me believe he has a straight/busted draw as the majority of his range. Since we are stacking off here anyways, Inducing seems to be the best way to go to get maximium value since he will bluff with the busted crap but never call.

I am not trying to rep a bluff at all. I am trying to act like I am excersisng pot control in order to induce a shove from worse hands. A larger turn bet may put him on shove or fold right there. I want to give him a bit more rope in order to have a better chance of stacking him.

Fat Nicky · #16 08-29-2007, 12:06 AM

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he will bluff with the busted crap but never call.

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the fact that his stack is less than the pot will not stop this guy from bluffing.

NoahSD · #17 08-29-2007, 12:10 AM

Preflop's pretty light, just FYI.

Like everyone and their mother is saying, your turn bet is too small. You need to get max value out of all the hands that would rather die than fold on this board, so just bet slightly less than pot so he's committed with like JTish on a blank river and so you get more out of 9Tish before he folds the river.

River's an easy call. WTF hand can he have that beats you? I see 67/QT. Then the hands that you beat include 89, X[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]X[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], AT, KT, etc.

Kowalski · #18 08-29-2007, 01:46 AM

Thanks for the replies. Yeah, I thought my turn bet was a little small, but my rationale was that I was going to check/call any missed draw rivers, and possibly pay off 1/2 potish bets if a scare card came... Is this the wrong mentality? The 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] was a decent card, because it wouldn't make too much sense for him to have a 7, but still put that 4 card straight + other bs possibilities.

Anyway I called and he showed A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. It was a pretty easy stack-off in retrospect, but I wanted some feedback.