I hate getting run over in the BB

[disjunction]

All good replies. If you want to consider a raise as part of an overall bluffing strategy that's fine. What if I told you that Mason specifically advocates check-calling in an article from this month's magazine, without even considering it worth a real discussion?

http://www.twoplustwo.com/magazine/c...assic0807.html

I posted an objection in the Magazine forum. I care less about the specific hand (although peeling seems very wrong to me), but more about the silly concept that one should care about whether your opponent is making a profit by betting his whole range. It's one thing that no one admits that this is wrong, but to then republish the incorrect reasoning is irksome.

I'd be interested if I'm wrong about the hand too, because I fold this without a thought. Basically, my thought is he's going to have an ace or a nine and the best I can hope is to catch a card (6 outs to 2nd pair, 12 outs to gutshot) that I don't even know if it helped me.

[Tryptamean]

I don't think he's really advocating c/c'ing, just that you cant always c/f here, as most people have mentioned so far.

I think that c/c'ing isn't "very wrong" either. I think you more credibly represent a pair with a c/c. Most Villians that make an effort to hand read will not fire a 2nd barrel when their opponent calls this flop. If that is the case, you have a profitable bluff on a lot of rivers after he checks behind. The downside is that he could suck out and catch a pair every time you do have the best hand.

I don't mind giving up immediately vs a complete unknown here. I don't mind c/c either. I think you are better off c/r'ing with some history on the villain however.

[Tryptamean]

re-reading ILP's response, I kind of like his c/r, c/f line a bit more. I was not a fan at first because many players (like myself) will peel KQ/KJ type hands if I am checkraised. However, these exact hands, I think, will almost always take a free card when you check the turn because they don't want you to own the [censored] out of them when you do have an Ace. I still think you'd be better off with some history between you and Villain before taking that line however.

[Tryptamean]

One other point. I object to their method of changing the Ace to a deuce. I understand the reasoning is to make people stick around in places that often miss your opponent, but it changes the dynamics of the hand way too much to provide an accurate analysis of the optimal play.

[sethypooh21]

C/R is good here sometimes. However, if the LAGTAG is good, expect to get rebluffed on the turn a ton. (IE you have to have the A or better a goodly portion of the time you C/R this flop.)

[yourface]

sethy what type of hands are you rebluffing on the turn as villain?

you would need a read that hero plays his aces wa/wb yes?

[sethypooh21]

[ QUOTE ]
sethy what type of hands are you rebluffing on the turn as villain?

you would need a read that hero plays his aces wa/wb yes?

[/ QUOTE ]

My hand doesn't matter if I'm going to rebluff.