Australia to sell uranium to India

[bobman0330]

Fair enough, but do you really think there's any chance that India will sign the NPT (which would require giving up their weapons)? And if there isn't such a chance, what are you really accomplishing, besides making it harder for a poor country to meet its energy requirements (and do so carbon-free, no less)?

[MidGe]

I guess I perceive it as a form of moral evasiveness at a nation level instead of individuals.

A bit like the "Don't ask we won't tell". I wish Australia had the backbone of New Zealand. I hope this will be set right after the elections (due at the end of this year, not announced yet). Our prime minister is a lame duck prime minister in the same way that your prez is a lame duck president. Fortunately he hasn't quite got the same extensive powers.

Now, to more precisely answer your question with what my question is, is why don't they want to sign the treaty? I can only think of one reason! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Josem]

[ QUOTE ]
Now, to more precisely answer your question with what my question is, is why don't they [India] want to sign the treaty? I can only think of one reason! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

the reason that springs to my mind is that they have two nuclear powers with a history of aggressive disputes on their doorstep? (being China and Pakistan, of course) that is a rather persuasive argument from their poitn of view to maintain a stockpile of nuclear weapons.

[MidGe]

In that case, the song and dance about Iran, by the US, is the height of hypocrisy, like the claim of WMD in Iraq.

But I guess, we better get used to the deceit of those in power (countries or individuals).

[Josem]

[ QUOTE ]
In that case, the song and dance about Iran, by the US, is the height of hypocrisy, like the claim of WMD in Iraq.

But I guess, we better get used to the deceit of those in power (countries or individuals).

[/ QUOTE ]

while i understand that this was littlemore than a cheap shot, the underlying point is actually false.

there is a huge difference between the regime of iraq - which was led by one of the worlds' leading murderers of the 20th century, and who had a pretty clear track record of using chemical and biological weapons on people - and that of india - which is a progressive, developing, democratic state.

in addition, after a state has obtained nuclear weapons, it's obviously going to be rather costly (to put it mildly) in every sense of the word to take military action.

[Phil153]

[ QUOTE ]
In that case, the song and dance about Iran, by the US, is the height of hypocrisy, like the claim of WMD in Iraq.

[/ QUOTE ]
You don't see vast differences between India and those other countries?

India is a peaceful state with a well established democracy. I'd rather they have nuclear weapons that Russia or China. I actually think an increased Indian arsenal will be a bolster to peace in the region - it will greatly stay China's hand in the years to come.

The other point, not related to the politics, is that India is dominated by a religion (Hinduism) that has a reverence for life. I don't know how much you've travelled, but if you consider India in any way equivalent to Iran, Iraq or Pakistan, I suggest spending a week or two in each of those countries. US policy makes a lot more sense once you have.

[MidGe]

[ QUOTE ]
...and that of india - which is a progressive, developing, democratic state...


[/ QUOTE ]

Not progressive enough in its refusal to sign he NPT, imo.

Iran has signed it and never has claim that its development was not for nuclear arms, in fact the reverse, repeatedly stated that it was for energy use.


I still don't understand why the US demonizes one and not the other?

Again, I am not opposed to selling uranium to India, just for them to sign the treaty first.

[Josem]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
...and that of india - which is a progressive, developing, democratic state...


[/ QUOTE ]

Not progressive enough in its refusal to sign he NPT, imo.

[/ QUOTE ]

fair point.

[ QUOTE ]
I still don't understand why the US demonizes one and not the other?

[/ QUOTE ]

if you seriously don't see the difference between Saddam Hussein's Iraq and Democratic India, there's nothing anyone can say to change your mind.

[MidGe]

[ QUOTE ]
if you seriously don't see the difference between Saddam Hussein's Iraq and Democratic India, there's nothing anyone can say to change your mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

I keep mentioning Iran and you come back about Iraq... never mind, lets put the cards on the table.

In terms of democracy and progressiveness, how big is the difference between Australia and India, between India and Pakistan, between Pakistan and Iran (note not Iraq)? How would you rank them, which pair has the biggest difference and which one the smallest?

[Josem]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
if you seriously don't see the difference between Saddam Hussein's Iraq and Democratic India, there's nothing anyone can say to change your mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

I keep mentioning Iran and you come back about Iraq... never mind, lets put the cards on the table.

[/ QUOTE ]

if that's the case, i apologise - i thought you had mentioned iraq repeatedly.

but even if we take the case of iran, the president talks repeatedly about wiping israel (another sovereign country) off the face of the earth. he's probably not a friendly guy that i want to have access to nukes.

i don't have

[ QUOTE ]

In terms of democracy and progressiveness, how big is the difference between Australia and India, between India and Pakistan, between Pakistan and Iran (note not Iraq)? How would you rank them, which pair has the biggest difference and which one the smallest?

[/ QUOTE ]

out of 10, i rank australia at 9 and india at 8. i don't have a great deal of research/evidence to support this.

on the same scale, i rank pakistan at 2 and iran at 2. while pakistan doesn't have elections, at least the guy seems to respect the concept of law and order and isn't on a wide scale murdering spree.

iran, while they have elections, all candidates are vetted by the central authority, and so on.