AK PF kinda sticky situation, Stars 25 buy in - Page 2

Mingdu · #11 07-31-2007, 11:04 AM

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why shove into another big stack with A-high?

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serious?

JoeyJoJo Shabadu · #12 07-31-2007, 11:45 AM

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I shove here, their ranges are wider than what has been mentioned

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That's bad. We are 50xBB deep .. why shove into another big stack with A-high? I don't think that the range of BB is that wide .. after all he is re-raising an UTG raiser and a caller, and his raise indicates that he just wants to build a pot and not get rid of anyone.

I can definately see a fold here.
If you want to play the hand, call and get it all-in on any A or K flop....but be prepared to go broke against AA/KK

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So we call 10k hoping to hit the flop?... and when a king or ace hits we get no action from pp like qq jj tt 99? And when we don't hit the flop we don't continue? I think it's understood we're willing to go broke against AA... and KK we have outs to get lucky about 25% of the time.

Cornell Fiji · #13 07-31-2007, 12:07 PM

This is a very standard shove.

You will get called by AQ and sometimes 55-JJ just wants to see where they are at and they will fold to you.

Furthermore, you are only getting paid off on an A/K flop if he hit his set or if you are chopping.

This is an obvious squeeze situation. This is a very easy all in

jdog1999 · #14 07-31-2007, 12:12 PM

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So you show down a bluff, MP2 wants to see if he can hit some cards and see the same thing ... BB is squeezing.

I shove here, their ranges are wider than what has been mentioned

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I agree this looks like a typical squeeze play. I think pushing it the best option you have the most fold equity if you push allin . If you just raise BB might decide to come along and see the flop. I say calling is the worse option here. If you miss the flop you will have a difficult time continuing with the hand.

One other thing to consider, how important is making the money to you. If that is a goal that you have, then folding is not a bad option either.

guilt_trip · #15 07-31-2007, 12:20 PM

Any read on BB? Anyway I generally shove here. You have a boatload of FE and the BB could be squeezing or have a hand like 99 that will probably fold to your all in.

I really hate flat calling here. I'd rather fold than flat call, as you arent likely to get much action if you flop a pair

Cornell Fiji · #16 07-31-2007, 12:21 PM

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So you show down a bluff, MP2 wants to see if he can hit some cards and see the same thing ... BB is squeezing.

I shove here, their ranges are wider than what has been mentioned

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I agree this looks like a typical squeeze play. I think pushing it the best option you have the most fold equity if you push allin . If you just raise BB might decide to come along and see the flop. I say calling is the worse option here. If you miss the flop you will have a difficult time continuing with the hand.

One other thing to consider, how important is making the money to you. If that is a goal that you have, then folding is not a bad option either.

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Actually, this brings up a pretty sexy point. Since shoving is the best play you might want to reraise to 28,500 (obv get it in on any flop if he smooth calls) because that looks more like aces in conjunction with your UTG raise and it is more likely to get 77-QQ to fold... of course it is also less likely that AQ will call so you need to weigh the pros and cons of such a play.

registrar · #17 07-31-2007, 02:13 PM

Calling would be bad because the only time BB checks is when he flops a set or the flop is ace/king high and he has JJ. I'd just shove but you can reraise intimidatingly less.

black666 · #18 07-31-2007, 03:31 PM

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why shove into another big stack with A-high?

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serious?

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Yeah. Most tournament decisions are somewhat easy because the stacks aren't that big. That's also the reason why tournament players suck at cash games (deep stacks) or people go broke on the first level of the WSOP main event with AK and KK. They just aren't used to play deep stack poker where you can afford to wait for a real edge other than hoping that villain shows you QQ for a coinflip. You can set-mine the whole day .. so why would you shove 50BB preflop when the only hands that can call you are AA and KK?

@Cornell
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You will get called by AQ and sometimes 55-JJ just wants to see where they are at and they will fold to you.

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lol? Maybe in a freeroll or $1 MTT ... in a $25MTT with such deep stacks, I instafold QQ if I get shoved for 50BB.

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This is an obvious squeeze situation

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You do realize that the whole purpose of a squeeze play is to make both players fold? This tiny reraise is just a pot builder, nothing more .. we are getting over 2:1 on the call. If the BB wanted us to fold, he would raise bigger.

Cornell Fiji · #19 07-31-2007, 03:43 PM

Black,
You are right. I should stick to freerolls and $1 tourneys. These $25 buyin players are way too advanced for me.

Oh, and folding QQ preflop when 50 bbs deep... or folding KK preflop in the WSOP. If only I had enough high buyin experience I might be able to make those expert plays.

JoeyJoJo Shabadu · #20 07-31-2007, 03:43 PM

And the other difference between cash and MTT is the winner take all chips format. Which seems somewhat neglected in your thinking of folding QQ and AK. You need to be a bully. You need to push edges. You need to get lucky. You do not win an MTT by set-mining all day or passive play.

Sorry... but thats just the way I roll.