1/2 - Turn nuts in huge pot, followed by worst river ever.

[GLKST526]

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for any who advocate betting the river (babar), are you folding to a raise? only from certain players? 3betting lol?

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I call one and probably fold for two. 3betting is absurd, especially if it's UTG doing it.

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Agreed. The pot is just too big to fold for one extra bet, but what is someone possibly 3 betting on that board that can't beat a straight? I'd fold and cry when I saw A7 and KJ

[tyler_cracker]

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The problem with not C betting the flop is that if you check the flop after raising out of the blinds, you are saying hey, didn't hit my hand please steal this from me, and someone is going to oblige, which puts you in the position of either folding, or calling OOP and hoping to hit your hand with a very limited idea of what the bettor has.

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this is a complex topic that i'm not going to fully explore right now, but this is a very dangerous mode of thinking. raising preflop does not obligate you to bet the flop. if you always cbet, you are spewing.

yes, it sucks to be oop and to whiff the flop and to check, but that's a lot better than tossing a bet in because "checking is weak/turns my hand face up/to find out where i'm at".

[GLKST526]

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this is a complex topic that i'm not going to fully explore right now, but this is a very dangerous mode of thinking. raising preflop does not obligate you to bet the flop. if you always cbet, you are spewing.


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I agree, which is why I qualified that in this particular case I would make the C-bet because I had the overs, the straight draw, and the backdoor nut flush draw, and that if I did not have those things I'd be fine with check folding. I do agree that cbetting regardless of situation is the very definition of spew, and that this particular situation is not ideal for one. However, in this particular case (and I certainly may be wrong about this), it seems that the hero feels committed to at least seeing a turn card, and my opinion is that if you are going to stick around for that I prefer a bet as opposed to a check call

[Xhad]

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yes, it sucks to be oop and to whiff the flop and to check, but that's a lot better than tossing a bet in because "checking is weak/turns my hand face up/to find out where i'm at".

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tyler, you know I am right there with you on this topic in general but given hero's nut gutshot + BDFD + possibly clean ace outs his equity is such that I don't think a bet is seriously bad here. In fact I think it's pretty much mandatory with one fewer caller so it can't be too far wrong here even if it's wrong. I figure you know all this since you called it "meh" but I think this is a fine place to fire even though hero will almost never take it down right there.

[Shillx]

I'd bet the FT&R