2/4 44 ZOMG I HIT STRAIGHT AND FLUSH!

[Befolder]

Grunch.

Well played I think. The river is a toughy. It may come down to how often we think our oppoent would bluff if we checked or how often they'd call w/ an ace (no club)if we bet.

Hmmmm. Also, how often might they fold a better club if we bet.

So I think it's a bet/fold. We may get some aces to call.

[Befolder]

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okay i may have changed my mind again, it depends if we bet if he's calling with a lot of nonflush hands. we both want to showdown here in this battle and he could easily have aces, aces up, nonflush hands that can call.

and if we bet riv i don't think he's raising nonflush hands, and probably only j/q high flushes or better, so if he raises i think we can fold safely.

okay so i'm back to b/f.

that's my thought process in motion, heh.

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Dude, being wishy washy is kind of my thing. Quit stepping on my schtick (poor analysis).
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[Befolder]

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Checking is terrible. Its a sticky spot in the first place dont make it worse by letting villain play his hand perfectly.

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not really...most anyone will bluff at this pot if we check, especially an aggro. In order to b/c I think we have to be reasonably sure he is bluffing, not value betting, which I figure is about 50/50 (half the time he has a club, half the time he doesn't).

c/c allows us to catch a bluff when ahead and minimize losses when behind. b/f is probably the worst line i can come up with.

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His postflop numbers don't suggest more passive. He only appears aggro pf.

[numbnuts007]

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Checking is terrible. Its a sticky spot in the first place dont make it worse by letting villain play his hand perfectly.

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not really...most anyone will bluff at this pot if we check, especially an aggro. In order to b/c I think we have to be reasonably sure he is bluffing, not value betting, which I figure is about 50/50 (half the time he has a club, half the time he doesn't).

c/c allows us to catch a bluff when ahead and minimize losses when behind. b/f is probably the worst line i can come up with.

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His postflop numbers don't suggest more passive. He only appears aggro pf.

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An AF of 1.1 with a VPIP is plenty aggressive. Plenty.

I think this is a c/c for sure. We want to show down and we're getting very few calls from hands that we beat. A b/f is really close, but i still prefer the c/c. This is one of those situations where it's so close that it's hardly worth arguing over, although I'm sure that won't stop many of you.

[Befolder]

I pretty much waffled over both river lines too, so yeah, neither seems wrong.

[Grease]

I'm undecided from B/C and C/C, but I can say definitively that I hate B/F, especially if the opponent is tricky. Our hand has a really good chance of being good here frequently, and I want to see a showdown, so if I had to pick (which I do) I'd pick B/C, but feel free to flame away.

[BigBadBabar]

i think we win the pot more often when 0-1 bets go in on the river, and lose it more often when 2 bets go in, so i'm happy to c/c and not b/c, since b/f (after sleeping on it) seems gross and unfair to our lovely hand that we made a straight and a flush with and want to see showdown with in a blind battle. also i disagree with you guys who say b/c means we win the pot like ever.

[TheCount212]

What a great discussion here..

Okay, call me crazy, but I really, really HATE b/f'ing. Anytime. And especially here. It's just not in my nature to fold a hand for one more bet that I liked enough to bet on the river in the first place. So b/f ain't happening, ever.

That leaves b/c and c/c. I remember reading some good advice from Sklansky in HFAP where he says we shouldn't bet where we'd hate to be raised. This seems like a situation that's tailor-made for that advice.

I vote c/c and pray my little 4c is good enough to take it down. If I had any club higher than 8c in my hand I'd bet this river.. but there's only one club left in the deck lower than mine here. Let's be practical, people. =]

[*TT*]

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I'm undecided from B/C and C/C, but I can say definitively that I hate B/F, especially if the opponent is tricky. Our hand has a really good chance of being good here frequently, and I want to see a showdown, so if I had to pick (which I do) I'd pick B/C, but feel free to flame away.

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Lame. If he is that tricky that he will bluff the river without a flush then let him have it, hero only beats duces & trays. Bet/fold for the win.

[BigBadBabar]

where did it come from that he is that tricky? it never says tricky anywhere. he's just overloose and aggressive.