1st Daily Post: Fun w/ QQ

[The Dude]

As ProfessorBen has pointed out, the loose-passive type that is the SB isn't going to have a flush draw here. This changes where I'm at vs his range quite a bit, and not in my favor.

However, I've been beating up this guy's blind for many hours now, and showing down winning hands that are quite a bit below his preflop raising standards, so it's also possible that he has some random Jx hand and is determined to put in bets, or Axd, or something else. But it would be out of character for him to play those like this.

[mongidig]

I like your line to cap the flop here, however, this is Vegas and they have a 5 bet cap. Still, I think 4 betting here may slow down the BB and he may just call and check to you on the turn anyway fearing a bigger hand as passive players do. MP is probably getting all his money in at some point. More often than not you are behind here although I am just basing this off your description of him being passive.

I think reraising the turn would be bad since I think you are behind and even in the minority of times you are ahead BB is not folding here because he is a loose passive tourist(which isn't horrible those times you are ahead) so getting a better hand to fold is out of the question. He may reraise you and force you to fold. Against passive players I would just assume get to showdown as cheaply as possible especially against a player you don't always play against to see his hand.

[goofball]

Clearly your plan was to call and raise the turn, why are you chickening out?

That being said, I think most of the time you should just 4bet the flop and go from there.

[ProfessorBen]

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c/c is spew.

[/ QUOTE ]

? Does that mean you think we should fold to one bet on some rivers? Do you really think that?

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A loose-passive also never has a single pair at this point unless it's exactly AJ.

[/ QUOTE ]

You pretty sure about that? I strongly disagree.

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1. It means that FOUR bets going in on the big streets means we're toast.

2. You are wrong. This is a LP, not a LAG.

[ProfessorBen]

Villain might have another flush draw. 75dd, exactly. However, I don't think he would have any of these flush draws; AKdd, A4dd, 75dd. That would be a play a TAG or LAG would make, not a loose passive. Heck, a loose passive isn't even likely to donk here. he would just check call with one of those holdings.

[vmacosta]

[ QUOTE ]
Clearly your plan was to call and raise the turn, why are you chickening out?

That being said, I think most of the time you should just 4bet the flop and go from there.

[/ QUOTE ]
this is more or less what i was gonna say

[DpR]

Hmm, I dont really get the replies here. A "loose passive tourist" (i.e. type that is not 4 betting JJ preflop), cold called two pre, bet/3 bet the flop and now everyone wants to 3 bet the turn here?

I think Hero is behind the vast majority of the time here and this is closer to a fold than a raise. If BB has shown the ability to overplay a J then I would go ahead and call down. Even the rare time Hero is ahead, he is going to get rivered by the flush sometimes.

Maybe I am not getting the description correctly, but I think a loose passive tourist in a live game has 1 pair beat here 95% of the time (I would think he never bet/3bets the flop with diamonds or AJ).

In practice, I would call down; but like i said, I think it is closer to a fold than a raise.

[rafiki]

Given that we didn't cap the flop, I want to raise the turn. I'm with pokerbob, more bets please.

[andyfox]

This passive guy has been anything but since the flop. That doesn't necessarily mean he has you beat, it just means he likes his hand. I think I'm good for 3.5 more bets here and I think I prefer to raise a copacetic river where I won't loose any possible outs when I fold if he 3-bets and where I can see if he likes the river.

BTW, what are the rules: can BB (or SB, whoever the hell he is) raise on the turn after you call?

[mosch]

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Uh, what? UTG folded the flop so I doubt he's calling anything. And I can't think of a single hand we are beating if the loose passive tourist 3 bets the turn here, let alone being ahead of his range.

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Sorry, I read the hand once and then replied without checking it. I was thinking the loose-bad UTG was still in, not the loose-passive BB.

That said, I still raise for value, and I (possible unpopular view) don't fold to to a three-bet. He might like TPTK or two pair enough to do re-raise, and I'm ahead of one of those hands, and have outs on the other.