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  #11  
Old 07-15-2007, 03:07 PM
Chesskid1 Chesskid1 is offline
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Default Re: JJ in blinds with 3 raise callers. Raise or Call?

I would just shove, 25% of your stack is in the middle for the taking and your hand is most likely good. If you have 3k+ chips a flat call is fine, but with 1800, and all the dead money in the middle, a call here is just weak/passive.
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  #12  
Old 07-15-2007, 03:09 PM
Pokerfarian Pokerfarian is offline
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Default Re: JJ in blinds with 3 raise callers. Raise or Call?

[ QUOTE ]
Another reason, is you might be able to prevent two overcards (if they call your 3bet)from connecting on the river/turn?

[/ QUOTE ]
Lets say they have overcards, call your 3bet and miss the flop. Your saying the go and go has the advantage that they may now fold on the flop. This is not so! Your a 3:1 favourite and there only getting 2:1. You actually WANT their chips already in the pot. JJ is not a good hand to pull a SNG/GNG with. Shove it in straight away.
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  #13  
Old 07-15-2007, 03:34 PM
b-komplex b-komplex is offline
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Default Re: JJ in blinds with 3 raise callers. Raise or Call?

It's not pretty but I think you do have to shove here. The chances of the cold callers having QQ-AA are really low based on the way you describe table dynamics, also you are going to get called by 88-TT every now and then probably more than you would think. I think shoving is way more EV than calling. Go and go is awful in this spot due to stack sizes and your hand.
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  #14  
Old 07-15-2007, 03:42 PM
ChipSpeak ChipSpeak is offline
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Default Re: JJ in blinds with 3 raise callers. Raise or Call?

This many hands to a flop with our hand is not an option if we can avoid it. I agree, our stack size is too small to do anything but shove. We have limited fold equity after a flop with a raise to 600, plus we will not isolate with the pot odds we would create. Shove it in, take the 15 BB's, worse case we'll be running against what should be an inferior hand. Flat calling is not an option PF, too big of a hand to play for set value, so we do not want multiple hands taking the flop & we'll have no stack to maneuver .
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  #15  
Old 07-15-2007, 03:51 PM
WuTank WuTank is offline
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Default Re: JJ in blinds with 3 raise callers. Raise or Call?

shove is great.You are killing their ranges, and your line looks alot like a squeeze.
I think someone will look you up lighter than they should, so shove is optimal.
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  #16  
Old 07-15-2007, 04:23 PM
JARID JARID is offline
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Default Re: JJ in blinds with 3 raise callers. Raise or Call?

[ QUOTE ]
Any raise you make has to be a push because the pot size and the size of your stack. You can't raise to 700 then fold to a push, that's stupid. Just calling here with JJ is incredibly weak, it certainly rates to be the best hand. QQ+ is a small part of the range for an aggressive MP raiser, and you are almost certainly ahead of MP2 and MP3. Also, a lot of the time you get looked up here by middle pairs who put you on AK. I don't see any play here but a shove.

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
Well it is a move and it's called a go-and-go. However, it allows your opponents with overs to fold when they miss and call when they hit, which isn't exactly what we're looking for. It's a better move with some crap that's still behind when you both miss rather than a hand that's ahead when you both miss. Anyway, you're a huge favorite if they miss the flop, so I don't really see the benefit of this move over a shove PF.

[/ QUOTE ]

QFT.
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