NL10 KK River Question

[Specialwon]

I really hate these full length adventures with calling stations, particularly with only a pair. If you are going to stack him, you need a better hand than this.

My solution is to push these guys out of the pot no later than the turn, just shove, watch him fold his hand which you know is junk, take the $3 and move on to the next hand.

Definitely your turn bet was too small imo, you needed him to be paying top dollar to carry on drawing (which he most likely was at that point).

On the river, he may well have a 7 but I would not put it really any higher than 50-50. By betting you get to set the price you are prepared to pay and you give him a chance to make a mistake with junk. I say bet about $3, fold to a raise. If you check, this mutt is going to think you lost your nerve and you will get blown off the hand whether or not you beat him.

[Specialwon]

lol, you posted the result at the same time as my post. See, shoulda shoved that turn.

[threads13]

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I am bet folding here. I think there is allot times you see a 52/2 show down allot here that you do beat like a-10 or 10-j or even allot worse for that matter he could also a flush draw/pair. I could also see the argument for c/c here with the draw heavy board but I hate to give up any value against a player like this which is a leak of mine some times.

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I didn't pay close enough attention to villains stats, and after looking back, I think that given his passive nature, this would be a good spot to b/f, since he probably won't bluff with his missed draws on the river, but he will call with a lot of worse hands.

So I change my answer to agree with Jack, b/f.

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I make this post a lot.

When a guy plays 50% of his hands and has an aggression factor greater than 2 he is playing quite aggressive. This guy is not passive.

[threads13]

I think you can bet more on the flop and turn. This guy will probably call a bit too often.

I think the turn is a c/c as he will bluff some busted draws or value bet a worse hand.

If that turn card didn't make board as dangerous you could c/c the turn also.

[Specialwon]

Just looking at the hand again, I get the impression you almost wanted him to call you on every street. If I'm right, then your fundamental mistake here is overvaluing top pair.

I've just spent the afternoon playing in a limit tourney, which definitely reminded me how weak TP pf really is when your opponents are permitted to see all 5 cards.

[threads13]

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Just looking at the hand again, I get the impression you almost wanted him to call you on every street. If I'm right, then your fundamental mistake here is overvaluing top pair.

I've just spent the afternoon playing in a limit tourney, which definitely reminded me how weak TP pf really is when your opponents are permitted to see all 5 cards.

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Don't forget who you are playing against. If the guy will call down with worse than top pair, then top pair is a solid hand to have.

[Specialwon]

Ahh, but he has an AF of 2, which is aggressive but certainly not psycho. He is quite capable of making rational plays on the river.

In a loose environment splashing around pf in lots of hands, getting to see many flops cheaply is not that bad a strategy. What's more, it antagonises the better players, who think this is a moronic way to play and they think, just wait you fiend, when I get a good hand... By inducing that mindset, unfortunately the villain is through his table image improving his implied odds when chasing gutshots and so forth. Tight players get angry and excited, they are tempted to shove this river because villain does not "deserve" to have a good hand, which I suspect is what actually happened here altho the cap'n didn't say so.

It's how I used to play when I started NL10, believe it or not it can be quite a successful strategy. I only stopped playing this way bc ppl on this forum told me it was wrong.

[threads13]

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Ahh, but he has an AF of 2, which is aggressive but certainly not psycho. He is quite capable of making rational plays on the river.

In a loose environment splashing around pf in lots of hands, getting to see many flops cheaply is not that bad a strategy. What's more, it antagonises the better players, who think this is a moronic way to play and they think, just wait you fiend, when I get a good hand... By inducing that mindset, unfortunately the villain is through his table image improving his implied odds when chasing gutshots and so forth. Tight players get angry and excited, they are tempted to shove this river because villain does not "deserve" to have a good hand, which I suspect is what actually happened here altho the cap'n didn't say so.

It's how I used to play when I started NL10, believe it or not it can be quite a successful strategy. I only stopped playing this way bc ppl on this forum told me it was wrong.

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You have to take the aggression factor in context of the total hands played.

CV mentioned in the OP that he is a bit aggressive.

Both of your posts seem to indicate that you believe captain overplayed his hand.

In response to my response(ha) it seems as if you are saying that captain let this one get way out of hand and overplayed his hand. You seem to think that the villain is getting the bets of captain by playing way loose.

He has an overpair against a (probably) bad player. If he had more of a read he could play this differently. I don't think there is any reason to think he doesn't have the best hand at this point. I don't think captain's play was exploitive of this player or out of line. You are giving this player way too much credit if you think captain is getting outplayed in this spot. Too much TV is my guess... [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

How big of a pot a hand deserves is a variable.

[Specialwon]

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No nothing that good, called me down with QJo, don't ask me how I know that. It's making me tilt again just thinking about it and my play.

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No, you misunderstand me. I think he UNDERplayed his hand a bit on the flop, and a lot on the turn. I guess from the above that he OVERplayed the river. Dude, I know you mean well but there's no need to be patronising, I do at least play this level.

[machine]

i like bet/fold by not betting your missing value, and if he raises you can chuck, i like maybe 1/3 pot.

i would use the C/C line against most villans.