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#11
05-30-2007, 03:02 PM
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Re: 300NL 2 live hands shortstacked
[ QUOTE ]
why did you shove in hand 1? you have no FE, and now you're just calling w/ a draw. there is no sidepot yet, build one... [/ QUOTE ] definitely go allin a turn card either completes an obvious draw or misses and makes it ugly if the 'poor' caller calls behind or folds doesn't really matter. A fold might 'buy' additional outs. A call is good with the monster being held. 
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#12
05-30-2007, 03:26 PM
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Re: 300NL 2 live hands shortstacked
If you really think King high has the pusher beat Oaky but otherwise this is wrong is so mnany ways I cant figure out where to start.
[ QUOTE ] if the 'poor' caller calls behind or folds doesn't really matter. [/ QUOTE ] Yes it does. He has money and we would like to have it in our stack. [ QUOTE ] A fold might 'buy' additional outs. [/ QUOTE ] We have more outs than a quality Omaha hand maybe as many as 18. We don't need outs we need customers. Do we really want to fold a guy thats drawing at 2 outs in a dry side pot. GS
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#13
05-30-2007, 03:45 PM
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Re: 300NL 2 live hands shortstacked
[ QUOTE ]
Do we really want to fold a guy thats drawing at 2 outs in a dry side pot. [/ QUOTE ] What? what hand is drawing to 2 outs against our king high? We are shallow enough where we are happy getting our $$$ in on this flop, absolutely. The shortstack allin has to be happy allin with hands that currently trail us (any 5, any dd). The "not so good" player could easily call the $25 more with hands that beat us, that he will fold for the extra $100. I don't see what's bad about that.
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#14
05-30-2007, 04:16 PM
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Re: 300NL 2 live hands shortstacked
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Do we really want to fold a guy thats drawing at 2 outs in a dry side pot. [/ QUOTE ] What? what hand is drawing to 2 outs against our king high? We are shallow enough where we are happy getting our $$$ in on this flop, absolutely. The shortstack allin has to be happy allin with hands that currently trail us (any 5, any dd). The "not so good" player could easily call the $25 more with hands that beat us, that he will fold for the extra $100. I don't see what's bad about that. [/ QUOTE ] The 2 outs comment was in responce to the buying outs that people keep bring up. If he hit a set on the turn and pushed we're okay with the few times that that happen because we would gladly have him call a push to begin with. The problem with a flop push IMO is he folds more hands we beat and worse draws, than hands we don't beat. So one more time here is the point I'm trying to get across. He's a bad player so he's probably not folding an overpair like 88 99 TT JJ often enough that it makes a flop push better than a call. With 18 outs I want him in the pot if for no other reason than the fact that I may be drawing to a chop on the straight. I just think buying 3 King outs with a push is not something I want to do when I could call and trap him with a naked 5 or some other worse draw. GS
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#15
05-30-2007, 04:18 PM
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Results
If anyone is interested. In hand one, the shortstack who check-raise pushed had 6-4 for top pair and a gutshot. The "not very good" guy called my huge raise with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], proudly announcing he could not fold top pair with the nut flush draw. Boom there went most of my outs, I did not improve and he took it down.
Hand 2 I pushed and got shown A-7 and did not improve. Definitely should have raised more PF methinks.
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