Should American Muslims be voting for Obama or killing him?

[theweatherman]

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but considering they gave him the middle name "Hussein" which is obviusly a Muslim name (I am not sure of the etiology of Barack) I think it would be safe to assume he was born Muslim

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Hussein is an Arab name. Not all Arabs are Muslims.

You should read more.

[pvn]

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Wrong on every assertion you made in your OP. n1!

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INCORRECT! His first assertion was dead-on.

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I admit I know I do not know a lot about Islam

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[Grey]

Personal attack deleted

[Grey]

This forum sucks.

[latefordinner]

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INCORRECT! His first assertion was dead-on.

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nh sir!

[latefordinner]

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him the middle name "Hussein" which is obviusly a Muslim name

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not anymore than "Jones" is a Christian name

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(I am not sure of the etiology of Barack)

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African origin, from Hebrew "Baruch" meaning "Blessed" (ZOMG does that mean Barack is really an African Jew?)



[/ QUOTE ]I think it would be safe to assume he was born Muslim

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Raised non religious. Went to both Catholic and Muslim schools. Father was rasied Muslim but identified as agnostic/atheistic by the time Obama was born. Currently considers himself Christian, attends and gives to a Christian church and regularly speaks at Christian events about his religion (as if anyone that considered themselves of another faith could run for potus!).

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does this mean the crime for converting from Islam is not death?

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AFAIK the charge of "apostasy" equating to "converting from Islam" resulting in a death sentence is rougly equivalent to saying that Christians believe an adulterous women should be killed. That is, there is possibly some scriptural basis for it, but the vast majority of practitioners do not believe so. In particular, many verses in the Quran support religious freedom:

1) 'If it had been the will of your Lord that all the people of the world should be believers, all the people of the earth would have believed! Would you then compel mankind against their will to believe?' (10:99)
2) '(O Prophet) proclaim: 'This is the Truth from your Lord. Now let him who will, believe in it, and him who will, deny it.'' (18:29)
3) 'If they turn away from thee (O Muhammad) they should know that We have not sent you to be their keeper. Your only duty is to convey My message.' (42:48)
4) 'Let there be no compulsion in religion.' (2:256)

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I admit I do not know Arabic and it is illegal to print the Koran in another language so I have never had the pleasure of reading this illustrious text.

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Really, i have a couple copies at home in English and studied it in an intro to theology class in college. Coulda fooled me.

[John Kilduff]

I'm afraid I must disagree with you on some points of fact and on some of what is suggested or implied.

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AFAIK the charge of "apostasy" equating to "converting from Islam" resulting in a death sentence is rougly equivalent to saying that Christians believe an adulterous women should be killed.

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That would be the Old Testament (Jewish), not the New Testament (Christian). For Christians, when Jesus Christ came and ushered in the New Covenant, all the old laws were superseded by the teachings, instructions, and the example of Jesus Christ.

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That is, there is possibly some scriptural basis for it,

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Possibly some basis? Death for apostasy is the standard for Shari'a law, and Shari'a conforms to all the most widely accepted schools of Islamic jurisprudence. If there were little basis, why then would it be universally set forth under Shari'a that the penalty for aspostasy shall be death?

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but the vast majority of practitioners do not believe so.

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Let's look at some percentages a little more closely:

According to opinion polls conducted by The Policy Exchange, a U.K.-based think tank, 36% of British Muslims between the ages of 16-24 believe that if a Muslim converts to another religion, they should be punished by death.

That's well under half, but it's still a huge slice of a group that holds such troubling views. The percentage would doubtless be higher yet still in many Muslim countries.

It's actually not merely a tiny minority of Muslims who believe that the penalty for apostasy should be death. It may well be a minority view worldwide (I don't know if it is or not) but it isn't an exceptionally uncommon view, either: a lot of Muslims believe that, as the poll shows.

A full 28% of British Muslims would prefer to live under Shari'a. For those aged 16-24, the percentage is 37%. For those over 55, the percentage is 17%.

13% of British Muslims between the ages of 16-24 admire al-Qaeda.

Those are very significant percentages which translate into huge raw numbers.

Shari'a is not just another cultural preference; it is a legal system which is directly opposed to many of the human rights and civil rights which are most cherished by Westerners. Especially, Shari'a law discriminates based upon gender and discriminates based upon religion.

For more information:

Policy Exchange Think Tank, PDF file (requires Adobe Acrobat Reader)

For the home site:

Policy Exchange

[DVaut1]

John Kilduff = MMMMMM

I think it's 50/50 I'm right on this.

[John Kilduff]

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I admit I know I do not know a lot about Islam, especially about the subtleties over definition of certain edicts, which seems to be the central debate over whether Islamic extremism is justified in the Koran or not.


However, one thing I have always believed I understood about Islam is that the crime for converting from it to another religion is death, and there is no wiggle room on this one.

Is this a correct notion or not? And if it is, does this make Obama political enemy #1 for American muslims, or does he get a slide on this one?

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It appears Obama was never a Muslim, so it really isn't even an applicable question.

Below is an article linked from CNN.

The article says that the Indonesian school which Obama attended as a child for 6 years was a mixed school (students of different religions). The headmaster of the school said it was a "public school" and that it did not focus on religion.

Obama'a childhood attendance at this school is apparently on what the claim is based (a claim was made that "researchers connected to Senator Clinton" had discovere the story, but a Clinton spokesperson described that assertion as "an obvious right-wing hit job").

CNN Debunks

[Dane S]

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That would be the Old Testament (Jewish), not the New Testament (Christian).

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The Old Testament is as much a part of the Christian bible as the New Testament, so I'm not sure what you're getting at here.